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Childcare + car-centric urban planning robbed their safe space for play and socializing: Childcare is unreliable, very expensive, patchy, and time-consuming to

Childcare + car-centric urban planning robbed their safe space for play and socializing: Childcare is unreliable, very expensive, patchy, and time-consuming to sort out. School starts at 9am and finishes at 3pm. This is incompatible with working hours. Also, tt would help parents who WFH if kids could play outside (like I used to when I was a kid). They can't because car-centric street designs took their space. Children are an after-thought whose needs don't fit into modern society.

agent008t 4y ago
School from 9am to 3pm at a young age when childcare is most required is ridiculously long hours. This suggests to me that schools already take on much of the daycare role. That to me also seems very wrong. School should first and foremost concern itself with effective education. If children can only study effectively for 2-3 hours a day, that is how long schoolday should last. Parents that need childcare should seek it elsewhere - that should be outside of the scope of schools' responsibilities.
- actfrench 4y ago
  Totally agree. Our current school schedule is based on a 1930's farm schedule and hasn't changed in the last 100 years. Currently school is trying to do education, socialization and childcare in one big lump and doing all poorly. I fear though, that if school was not responsible for childcare, there would be no support at all for childcare for working parents - and we've seen the disastrous childcare crisis already in effect for ages 0-5. So this problem needs attention too. I wrote more about the idiocy of lumping childcare, education and socialization together here : https://manisharoses.medium.com/not-school-or-homeschooling-but-modular-learning-5233927f8fc9 https://manisharoses.medium.com/not-school-or-homeschooling-...
  - agent008t 4y ago
    Thanks, good article. I have a data point that is perhaps relevant. I went to school in Eastern Europe in the 90s, and my education from secondary school onwards was naturally modular. Normal day school was from 8:30-12:40 or 8:30-13:30 most days, with homework afterwards. But it was effectively optional - quality of education was tailored to the lowest common denominator, and it was universally understood that you are not getting into any decent university by just attending school. Universities set their own entrance exams, school marks did not matter to them, and they did not care how you got to reach the high entrance bar that they set. So teachers, principals, parents all understood and acknowledged that preparing for entrance exams comes first, that they are probably not qualified enough to prepare you, and so school comes second. And there were many options for actually learning. Many parents paid for private tutors. But there were also (free) computer clubs, where somebody would volunteer to work with children on programming or 3d modelling projects - some structured, and some unstructured, where you would just turn up, try to create, ask questions and be helped out, progressing at your own pace through your own interest. There were very affordable maths and physics classes by post - where they would mail you textbooks and a timetable, and you would mail back completed homework, receiving feedback. There were evening schools, some of them free, where you would attend lectures and classes in person, mostly geared towards maths and physics, which would give you first class education - if you cared to learn. If you skipped school or did not do your homework, or were even working on something of your own during classes, it was tolerated by the 'compulsory' schools. So effectively, you were free to pursue your own modular education in the spirit that you describe. And those that wanted to learn, people that I know, did very well out of it.
    - actfrench 4y ago
      Wonderful! What country was this in?
actfrench 4y ago
I agree with you that urban planning is contributing to the problem. Kids and adults are separated and there are very few family friendly spaces. People see kid energy as loud and annoying. I was raised as a single mom and she used to bring me literally everywhere. She just didn't care when people gave her looks. It worked well for us. I was pretty well-behaved just sitting in the corner reading a book while she lectured or attended meditation class. Only exception was restaurants where I used to throw HUGE tantrums. With regards to the 9-3 schedule, this is one of the great things about homeschooling/unschooling/modular learning. Just like you can design your child's education, you can design their social experiences and their childcare experiences to optimize them for your child and family. School needs to evolve with an evolving work force and 9-3 doesn't make sense. If you don't live in an urban area, it's totally possible to set up an outdoor work space while your kids play outside. Kids may be an afterthought for society, but they are definitely NOT for most parents. And we need to be more assertive about making sure that needs as a family are met. For example, it's unacceptable for a huge corporation to design a multi million dollar space with no daycare - and certainly not conducive to hiring talented women to work there who could bring a ton to the company. Also, parents need to be more aggressive about asking their jobs to let them carve out time for the kids. With remote work it's hard, because when your kid gets sick, it's not like you are out of the office at home with them, you're supposed to be on and tuned in remotely while they are at home with you working.

agent008t 4y ago

School from 9am to 3pm at a young age when childcare is most required is ridiculously long hours. This suggests to me that schools already take on much of the daycare role. That to me also seems very wrong. School should first and foremost concern itself with effective education. If children can only study effectively for 2-3 hours a day, that is how long schoolday should last. Parents that need childcare should seek it elsewhere - that should be outside of the scope of schools' responsibilities.

actfrench 4y ago
Totally agree. Our current school schedule is based on a 1930's farm schedule and hasn't changed in the last 100 years. Currently school is trying to do education, socialization and childcare in one big lump and doing all poorly. I fear though, that if school was not responsible for childcare, there would be no support at all for childcare for working parents - and we've seen the disastrous childcare crisis already in effect for ages 0-5. So this problem needs attention too. I wrote more about the idiocy of lumping childcare, education and socialization together here : https://manisharoses.medium.com/not-school-or-homeschooling-but-modular-learning-5233927f8fc9 https://manisharoses.medium.com/not-school-or-homeschooling-...
- agent008t 4y ago
  Thanks, good article. I have a data point that is perhaps relevant. I went to school in Eastern Europe in the 90s, and my education from secondary school onwards was naturally modular. Normal day school was from 8:30-12:40 or 8:30-13:30 most days, with homework afterwards. But it was effectively optional - quality of education was tailored to the lowest common denominator, and it was universally understood that you are not getting into any decent university by just attending school. Universities set their own entrance exams, school marks did not matter to them, and they did not care how you got to reach the high entrance bar that they set. So teachers, principals, parents all understood and acknowledged that preparing for entrance exams comes first, that they are probably not qualified enough to prepare you, and so school comes second. And there were many options for actually learning. Many parents paid for private tutors. But there were also (free) computer clubs, where somebody would volunteer to work with children on programming or 3d modelling projects - some structured, and some unstructured, where you would just turn up, try to create, ask questions and be helped out, progressing at your own pace through your own interest. There were very affordable maths and physics classes by post - where they would mail you textbooks and a timetable, and you would mail back completed homework, receiving feedback. There were evening schools, some of them free, where you would attend lectures and classes in person, mostly geared towards maths and physics, which would give you first class education - if you cared to learn. If you skipped school or did not do your homework, or were even working on something of your own during classes, it was tolerated by the 'compulsory' schools. So effectively, you were free to pursue your own modular education in the spirit that you describe. And those that wanted to learn, people that I know, did very well out of it.
  - actfrench 4y ago
    Wonderful! What country was this in?

actfrench 4y ago

I agree with you that urban planning is contributing to the problem. Kids and adults are separated and there are very few family friendly spaces. People see kid energy as loud and annoying. I was raised as a single mom and she used to bring me literally everywhere. She just didn't care when people gave her looks. It worked well for us. I was pretty well-behaved just sitting in the corner reading a book while she lectured or attended meditation class. Only exception was restaurants where I used to throw HUGE tantrums. With regards to the 9-3 schedule, this is one of the great things about homeschooling/unschooling/modular learning. Just like you can design your child's education, you can design their social experiences and their childcare experiences to optimize them for your child and family. School needs to evolve with an evolving work force and 9-3 doesn't make sense. If you don't live in an urban area, it's totally possible to set up an outdoor work space while your kids play outside. Kids may be an afterthought for society, but they are definitely NOT for most parents. And we need to be more assertive about making sure that needs as a family are met. For example, it's unacceptable for a huge corporation to design a multi million dollar space with no daycare - and certainly not conducive to hiring talented women to work there who could bring a ton to the company. Also, parents need to be more aggressive about asking their jobs to let them carve out time for the kids. With remote work it's hard, because when your kid gets sick, it's not like you are out of the office at home with them, you're supposed to be on and tuned in remotely while they are at home with you working.