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It seems like Java is in a pretty unique place in terms of the quality of the tools and the frequent need to use complex tools to get even a vague idea what's g

It seems like Java is in a pretty unique place in terms of the quality of the tools and the frequent need to use complex tools to get even a vague idea what's going on.

invalidname 4y ago
True. But Idea Ultimate works surprisingly well with JavaScript and very well with Typescript including react code, etc. It's so much easier than going through NPM noise. Just auto fix and in 95% of the cases it's just what I need. The JetBrains IDEs for other platforms have almost the same level of capabilities. I also worked a lot with xcode, its not nearly as good as AppCode but it's still an improvement over trying to build iOS from the command line... I did that a lot and that isn't a pleasant experience in the least.
- deleted 4y ago
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- Macha 4y ago
  I should give it another go I guess. My last serious shake of Jetbrains for JS was on an angular 1 + gulp project a few years ago and it just couldn't do anything helpful.
spullara 4y ago
The only reason Java can even have the most powerful tools is because it is easy to see what is going on. Also, JetBrains does really well with all languages, generally more than any other IDE.
- anonymoushn 4y ago
  I haven't encountered features in other languages that are pervasively used and work by leaving meaningless markers in the code which some other (typically undocumented, typically in another repository) code will eventually use to do codegen, AST rewriting, and so on. But other than this feature that's like way more difficult than macros in Lisp or C, which makes up like 20% of non-whitespace lines in Java code I have encountered in the last few years, I agree.
  - spullara 4y ago
    If you mean annotations that are easily traceable to the package that provides them, I suppose. That isn't how I program in Java these days but a lot of people do like that style. Honestly though I don't find it much different than Derive in Rust or extension methods in Swift.
EdwardDiego 4y ago
Any large code base benefits from complex tools to get an idea of what's going on. Intellij / PyCharm does remarkably well with large Python code bases lacking type annotations, even if it has to take a guess here and there. But when you add type annotations, it's even better.

It seems like Java is in a pretty unique place in terms of the quality of the tools and the frequent need to use complex tools to get even a vague idea what's going on.

invalidname 4y ago

True. But Idea Ultimate works surprisingly well with JavaScript and very well with Typescript including react code, etc. It's so much easier than going through NPM noise. Just auto fix and in 95% of the cases it's just what I need. The JetBrains IDEs for other platforms have almost the same level of capabilities. I also worked a lot with xcode, its not nearly as good as AppCode but it's still an improvement over trying to build iOS from the command line... I did that a lot and that isn't a pleasant experience in the least.

deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
Macha 4y ago
I should give it another go I guess. My last serious shake of Jetbrains for JS was on an angular 1 + gulp project a few years ago and it just couldn't do anything helpful.

spullara 4y ago

The only reason Java can even have the most powerful tools is because it is easy to see what is going on. Also, JetBrains does really well with all languages, generally more than any other IDE.

anonymoushn 4y ago
I haven't encountered features in other languages that are pervasively used and work by leaving meaningless markers in the code which some other (typically undocumented, typically in another repository) code will eventually use to do codegen, AST rewriting, and so on. But other than this feature that's like way more difficult than macros in Lisp or C, which makes up like 20% of non-whitespace lines in Java code I have encountered in the last few years, I agree.
- spullara 4y ago
  If you mean annotations that are easily traceable to the package that provides them, I suppose. That isn't how I program in Java these days but a lot of people do like that style. Honestly though I don't find it much different than Derive in Rust or extension methods in Swift.

EdwardDiego 4y ago

Any large code base benefits from complex tools to get an idea of what's going on. Intellij / PyCharm does remarkably well with large Python code bases lacking type annotations, even if it has to take a guess here and there. But when you add type annotations, it's even better.