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Wow, broad question. I know for pharma it's skimmed off the supply chain. But I have a hard time believing all black market guns, or even the majority, are stol

Wow, broad question. I know for pharma it's skimmed off the supply chain. But I have a hard time believing all black market guns, or even the majority, are stolen from residences. I imagine this is a case for low-level criminals, sometimes, but again some proof would clear it up.

mulmen 4y ago
Of course they aren’t all stolen. Why would that absolute be implied or necessary? The question is if any guns are stolen and the effect of publishing this list on the number of stolen guns. I’m not sure how that is controversial. There can be other sources of guns. That doesn’t make this less bad.
- sha256sum 4y ago
  Well the comment was in response to a claim that criminals get guns through burglary. Being a diligent person, I asked for a citation because it seemed like someone was making a claim out of their ass. I was right: https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/guns/procon/guns.html https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/guns/procon/g...
  - mulmen 4y ago
    Your link doesn't say what you seem to think it says. Gun theft is not the main way criminals get guns but it doesn't matter because it is still a way. Specifically it is the way that this data leak can contribute to the number of stolen guns.
    - ClumsyPilot 4y ago
      dying by getting tangled in bedsheets is not the Main way to die, but its still a way, so we should get rid of bedsheets. if some contrived scenario represents less than 1% of the problem we are discussing, it's not a real problem. there are 8 billion people in the world, and it is always possible to find someone who has done something, no matter how ridiculous.
      - mulmen 4y ago
        The leak of gun owners isn’t likely to contribute to the number of straw purchases. It could directly lead to gun thefts. The existence of a problem does not dismiss the validity of another.
        8note 4y ago
        Open carrying similarly can directly lead to gun thefts. Its not the governments responsibility to secure your guns either way. If anything more public detailed information about who owns guns is better so that people can properly avoid dangerous gun owners
        mulmen 4y ago
        > Open carrying similarly can directly lead to gun thefts. Ok? So we agree? > Its not the governments responsibility to secure your guns either way. Ok? But that’s not been argued. It is also the government’s responsibility to not endanger the lives of citizens. > If anything more public detailed information about who owns guns is better so that people can properly avoid dangerous gun owners This list contains the names and employment details of judges and corrections officers (and their families) who are at risk of revenge. It may also contain the name of survivors of assault who wish to protect themselves from their abusers.
        notch656a 4y ago
        >If anything more public detailed information about who owns guns is better so that people can properly avoid dangerous gun owners Included in the 'leak' were people who merely _applied_ for a CCW. Not necessarily that you have a weapon or even a CCW license. And where does this 'so we can avoid dangerous <x>' end? For instance, controlled substance prescriptions become government owned data when they are relayed to the DEA. Shall we publish private information of anyone prescribed anything related to conditions that increase their chance of being at risk of committing a violent crime?
robonerd 4y ago
> But I have a hard time believing all black market guns, or even the majority, are stolen from residences. Many are likely stolen from cars. Leaving a gun in the glove compartment isn't terribly uncommon in America, nor are car break-ins.

mulmen 4y ago

Of course they aren’t all stolen. Why would that absolute be implied or necessary? The question is if any guns are stolen and the effect of publishing this list on the number of stolen guns. I’m not sure how that is controversial. There can be other sources of guns. That doesn’t make this less bad.

sha256sum 4y ago
Well the comment was in response to a claim that criminals get guns through burglary. Being a diligent person, I asked for a citation because it seemed like someone was making a claim out of their ass. I was right: https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/guns/procon/guns.html https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/guns/procon/g...
- mulmen 4y ago
  Your link doesn't say what you seem to think it says. Gun theft is not the main way criminals get guns but it doesn't matter because it is still a way. Specifically it is the way that this data leak can contribute to the number of stolen guns.
  - ClumsyPilot 4y ago
    dying by getting tangled in bedsheets is not the Main way to die, but its still a way, so we should get rid of bedsheets. if some contrived scenario represents less than 1% of the problem we are discussing, it's not a real problem. there are 8 billion people in the world, and it is always possible to find someone who has done something, no matter how ridiculous.
    - mulmen 4y ago
      The leak of gun owners isn’t likely to contribute to the number of straw purchases. It could directly lead to gun thefts. The existence of a problem does not dismiss the validity of another.
      - 8note 4y ago
        Open carrying similarly can directly lead to gun thefts. Its not the governments responsibility to secure your guns either way. If anything more public detailed information about who owns guns is better so that people can properly avoid dangerous gun owners
        mulmen 4y ago
        > Open carrying similarly can directly lead to gun thefts. Ok? So we agree? > Its not the governments responsibility to secure your guns either way. Ok? But that’s not been argued. It is also the government’s responsibility to not endanger the lives of citizens. > If anything more public detailed information about who owns guns is better so that people can properly avoid dangerous gun owners This list contains the names and employment details of judges and corrections officers (and their families) who are at risk of revenge. It may also contain the name of survivors of assault who wish to protect themselves from their abusers.
        notch656a 4y ago
        >If anything more public detailed information about who owns guns is better so that people can properly avoid dangerous gun owners Included in the 'leak' were people who merely _applied_ for a CCW. Not necessarily that you have a weapon or even a CCW license. And where does this 'so we can avoid dangerous <x>' end? For instance, controlled substance prescriptions become government owned data when they are relayed to the DEA. Shall we publish private information of anyone prescribed anything related to conditions that increase their chance of being at risk of committing a violent crime?

robonerd 4y ago

> But I have a hard time believing all black market guns, or even the majority, are stolen from residences. Many are likely stolen from cars. Leaving a gun in the glove compartment isn't terribly uncommon in America, nor are car break-ins.