3 ms·

I don't doubt there's some people like this, but if I cut my teeth on mainframes 2-3 decades ago and was nearing retirement, I'm not sure I'd have the patience

by mwt 4y ago

I don't doubt there's some people like this, but if I cut my teeth on mainframes 2-3 decades ago and was nearing retirement, I'm not sure I'd have the patience needed to be a good mentor. (I'm sure I *should*, but as a personal limitation I might not, and I'm probably not alone.)

kjs3 4y ago
That's...sad? We try to cultivate a mentor culture. We have internal mentorship, college internships and organized internal cross-training. You can even do extended cross-training in other teams and try out new jobs (within certain limits). And the fact of the matter is we're terrible at it; should be more organized, easier to access, have more objective outcomes, with even more mentors. I bet an unfortunate fraction of our people don't even know we have formal programs. But very large numbers of folks here want it to work, and keep helping out, keep volunteering. I could pick up the phone right now and probably get a dozen or so greybeards from the mainframe group who would say "sure, I'll show a new kid the ropes". But you're certainly not an anomaly...there's clearly more people who would say "screw 'em...I got mine" than consider helping someone down the ladder.
- mwt 4y ago
  I've never worked somewhere in which mentorship was formalized *and* something for which there was a clear relationship to promotion. Not saying that the only way to get me more into it is by paying me or threatening compensation, but when push comes to shove the things that aren't tied to promotions are the first to go (especially in management). And also, I've noticed my desire to mentor has (slowly) gone down over time. I'm trying to avoid ageism and certainly not assume that seasoned COBOL devs are less eager to mentor than junior devs, and I hope I'm clear in that I'm projecting what is something of a personal limitation onto my future self.
  - kjs3 4y ago
    Yes, if the only metric that motivates you is "will this get me more money/promotion", you will certainly look down your nose at people who help others succeed and create fictions like 'no one' in their right mind would do that. My experience has been that there are numerous (though clearly not the majority) people who look at the world differently.
    - mwt 4y ago
      That's not what motivates me, thanks, but it's clearly what motivates the industry

by mwt 4y ago

kjs3 4y ago

That's...sad? We try to cultivate a mentor culture. We have internal mentorship, college internships and organized internal cross-training. You can even do extended cross-training in other teams and try out new jobs (within certain limits). And the fact of the matter is we're terrible at it; should be more organized, easier to access, have more objective outcomes, with even more mentors. I bet an unfortunate fraction of our people don't even know we have formal programs. But very large numbers of folks here want it to work, and keep helping out, keep volunteering. I could pick up the phone right now and probably get a dozen or so greybeards from the mainframe group who would say "sure, I'll show a new kid the ropes". But you're certainly not an anomaly...there's clearly more people who would say "screw 'em...I got mine" than consider helping someone down the ladder.

mwt 4y ago
I've never worked somewhere in which mentorship was formalized *and* something for which there was a clear relationship to promotion. Not saying that the only way to get me more into it is by paying me or threatening compensation, but when push comes to shove the things that aren't tied to promotions are the first to go (especially in management). And also, I've noticed my desire to mentor has (slowly) gone down over time. I'm trying to avoid ageism and certainly not assume that seasoned COBOL devs are less eager to mentor than junior devs, and I hope I'm clear in that I'm projecting what is something of a personal limitation onto my future self.
- kjs3 4y ago
  Yes, if the only metric that motivates you is "will this get me more money/promotion", you will certainly look down your nose at people who help others succeed and create fictions like 'no one' in their right mind would do that. My experience has been that there are numerous (though clearly not the majority) people who look at the world differently.
  - mwt 4y ago
    That's not what motivates me, thanks, but it's clearly what motivates the industry