5 ms·

> It is hard to argue with the fact that humans are social animals and gain enjoyment from connecting with others, whatever age we are. Maybe except for schizo

by xjay 4y ago

> It is hard to argue with the fact that humans are social animals and gain enjoyment from connecting with others, whatever age we are. Maybe except for schizoid personality disorder: > lack of interest in social relationships, a tendency toward a solitary or sheltered lifestyle, secretiveness, emotional coldness, detachment and apathy. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schizoid_personality_disorder https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schizoid_personality_disorde...

bowsamic 4y ago
Yes, that’s why it’s a disorder
- js8 4y ago
  It's not necessarily a disorder - AFAIK psychiatry considers something a disorder only if it causes harm to yourself or others. That's why being a homosexual is not a disorder, nor is being schizoid - if you're happy with that lifestyle, and not harming others, then it's not a disorder. I have a brother who is most likely schizoid, and he is - as far as everybody can tell - pretty happy and harmless.
  - q-big 4y ago
    > That's why being a homosexual is not a disorder In the past, it was: https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Homosexuality_and_psychology&oldid=1090528788 https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Homosexuality_and... "As a result of this scientific research, the American Psychiatric Association declassified homosexuality as a mental disorder in 1973. Upon a thorough review of the scientific data, the American Psychological Association followed in 1975 and also called on all mental health professionals to take the lead in "removing the stigma of mental illness that has long been associated" with homosexuality. In 1993, the National Association of Social Workers adopted the same position as the American Psychiatric Association and the American Psychological Association, in recognition of scientific evidence. The World Health Organization, which listed homosexuality in the ICD-9 in 1977, removed homosexuality from the ICD-10 which was endorsed by the 43rd World Health Assembly on 17 May 1990." I.e. the respective changes in the diagnostic manuals were only adopted in the 90s.
    - js8 4y ago
      Yes, and for the similar historical reason, schizoid personality disorder has "disorder" in the name, even though it's not considered an illness by modern psychiatry. OP should educate themselves.
      - bowsamic 4y ago
        It's listed in both the DSM-5 and the ICD-10 as a disorder https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schizoid_personality_disorder#Diagnosis https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schizoid_personality_disorder#...
q-big 4y ago
Relevant: Quote from The Jargon File: "Many hackers have noticed that mainstream culture has shown a tendency to pathologize and medicalize normal variations in personality, especially those variations that make life more complicated for authority figures and conformists. Thus, hackers aware of the issue tend to be among those questioning whether ADD and AS actually exist; and if so whether they are really ‘diseases’ rather than extremes of a normal genetic variation like having freckles or being able to taste DPT. In either case, they have a sneaking tendency to wonder if these syndromes are over-diagnosed and over-treated. After all, people in authority will always be inconvenienced by schoolchildren or workers or citizens who are prickly, intelligent individualists — thus, any social system that depends on authority relationships will tend to helpfully ostracize and therapize and drug such ‘abnormal’ people until they are properly docile and stupid and ‘well-socialized’." http://www.catb.org/jargon/html/weaknesses.html http://www.catb.org/jargon/html/weaknesses.html
- bowsamic 4y ago
  I can't stand this "Hacker supremacy" bs, and I think that Eric Raymond who you post here is where that all started. Hackers are not better at psychology than psychologists. I don't understand why there are these hackers who think they are better at all things (except of course, sports, the uncivilised unintellectual entertainment). I find it extremely off-putting
  - psychoslave 4y ago
    Surely you can find supremacists in almost any professional environment as soon as it requires some praised/valued skills. I’m not sure Eric was "the start of it all", although he certainly was instrumental in broadcasting this self complaisant cultural bias – as well as many other things that could be labelled more positively. Also, without casting any general discredit on psychologists, it’s important to keep in mind that they are also humans with their own biases. Positive critic by non-professional seems more balanced than blind acceptance. Of course systematic reassessment of things that point out your own weaknesses is an other matter.
- raxxorraxor 4y ago
Shugarl 4y ago
> lack of interest in social relationships, a tendency toward a solitary or sheltered lifestyle, secretiveness, emotional coldness, detachment and apathy. > Affected individuals may be unable to form intimate attachments to others and simultaneously possess a rich and elaborate but exclusively internal fantasy world. > stilted speech > a lack of deriving enjoyment from most activities. > feeling as though one is an "observer" rather than a participant in life. > an inability to tolerate emotional expectations of others, > a degree of asexuality. >idiosyncratic moral or political beliefs. > Symptoms typically start in late childhood or adolescence. Jesus, TIL I might have a Schizoid personality disorder.

by xjay 4y ago

bowsamic 4y ago

Yes, that’s why it’s a disorder

js8 4y ago
It's not necessarily a disorder - AFAIK psychiatry considers something a disorder only if it causes harm to yourself or others. That's why being a homosexual is not a disorder, nor is being schizoid - if you're happy with that lifestyle, and not harming others, then it's not a disorder. I have a brother who is most likely schizoid, and he is - as far as everybody can tell - pretty happy and harmless.
- q-big 4y ago
  > That's why being a homosexual is not a disorder In the past, it was: https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Homosexuality_and_psychology&oldid=1090528788 https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Homosexuality_and... "As a result of this scientific research, the American Psychiatric Association declassified homosexuality as a mental disorder in 1973. Upon a thorough review of the scientific data, the American Psychological Association followed in 1975 and also called on all mental health professionals to take the lead in "removing the stigma of mental illness that has long been associated" with homosexuality. In 1993, the National Association of Social Workers adopted the same position as the American Psychiatric Association and the American Psychological Association, in recognition of scientific evidence. The World Health Organization, which listed homosexuality in the ICD-9 in 1977, removed homosexuality from the ICD-10 which was endorsed by the 43rd World Health Assembly on 17 May 1990." I.e. the respective changes in the diagnostic manuals were only adopted in the 90s.
  - js8 4y ago
    Yes, and for the similar historical reason, schizoid personality disorder has "disorder" in the name, even though it's not considered an illness by modern psychiatry. OP should educate themselves.
    - bowsamic 4y ago
      It's listed in both the DSM-5 and the ICD-10 as a disorder https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schizoid_personality_disorder#Diagnosis https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schizoid_personality_disorder#...

q-big 4y ago

Relevant: Quote from The Jargon File: "Many hackers have noticed that mainstream culture has shown a tendency to pathologize and medicalize normal variations in personality, especially those variations that make life more complicated for authority figures and conformists. Thus, hackers aware of the issue tend to be among those questioning whether ADD and AS actually exist; and if so whether they are really ‘diseases’ rather than extremes of a normal genetic variation like having freckles or being able to taste DPT. In either case, they have a sneaking tendency to wonder if these syndromes are over-diagnosed and over-treated. After all, people in authority will always be inconvenienced by schoolchildren or workers or citizens who are prickly, intelligent individualists — thus, any social system that depends on authority relationships will tend to helpfully ostracize and therapize and drug such ‘abnormal’ people until they are properly docile and stupid and ‘well-socialized’." http://www.catb.org/jargon/html/weaknesses.html http://www.catb.org/jargon/html/weaknesses.html

bowsamic 4y ago
I can't stand this "Hacker supremacy" bs, and I think that Eric Raymond who you post here is where that all started. Hackers are not better at psychology than psychologists. I don't understand why there are these hackers who think they are better at all things (except of course, sports, the uncivilised unintellectual entertainment). I find it extremely off-putting
- psychoslave 4y ago
  Surely you can find supremacists in almost any professional environment as soon as it requires some praised/valued skills. I’m not sure Eric was "the start of it all", although he certainly was instrumental in broadcasting this self complaisant cultural bias – as well as many other things that could be labelled more positively. Also, without casting any general discredit on psychologists, it’s important to keep in mind that they are also humans with their own biases. Positive critic by non-professional seems more balanced than blind acceptance. Of course systematic reassessment of things that point out your own weaknesses is an other matter.
raxxorraxor 4y ago

Shugarl 4y ago

> lack of interest in social relationships, a tendency toward a solitary or sheltered lifestyle, secretiveness, emotional coldness, detachment and apathy. > Affected individuals may be unable to form intimate attachments to others and simultaneously possess a rich and elaborate but exclusively internal fantasy world. > stilted speech > a lack of deriving enjoyment from most activities. > feeling as though one is an "observer" rather than a participant in life. > an inability to tolerate emotional expectations of others, > a degree of asexuality. >idiosyncratic moral or political beliefs. > Symptoms typically start in late childhood or adolescence. Jesus, TIL I might have a Schizoid personality disorder.