Copyright is not like patents. If you arrive at the same result, by a different method, then even if the result is identical, there is no copyright violation.

Copyright is not like patents. If you arrive at the same result, by a different method, then even if the result is identical, there is no copyright violation. So "the creative choice of what data to include or exclude, the order and style in which the information is presented, etc." is very weak. You can copy all the data, and then make your own choice on what to include (for example "everything I can find"), and you would not be violating the copyright. The quote you gave is for things like making artwork based on certain patterns or letters in the data. But it won't help you if your creative choice is "everything" because there is no creativity there. > So, a list of facts still can be creative and valuable to the society A list of facts is not creative, it's simply work. And yes, it might be valuable, but that's not how we decide if something is copyrightable. > or what's the point of copyright in the first place. For creativity, rather than effort.