5 ms·

While I do understand where this view is coming from, I think it's also a major waste of time to complain about it. Let me put it this way - you are not entitl

by rocgf 4y ago

While I do understand where this view is coming from, I think it's also a major waste of time to complain about it. Let me put it this way - you are not entitled to a high-earning FAANG job. It's really that simple. It's a free market, and companies can select the way they recruit their people. You feel like it's a waste of time to learn Leetcode questions? Then don't do it. Case closed. I say this as someone who failed multiple algorithm questions because I did not invest enough time to be good at them.

Clubber 4y ago
>you are not entitled to a high-earning FAANG job. It's really that simple. He's not talking about FAANG jobs. He's talking about Joe Blow companies that pays "market rates," and "great benefits!" to code really boring stuff with no highlights on the resume. He said these companies are too lazy to research any references and are just copy/pasta leetcode tests to their interviewees; tests the hiring people probably can't even validate as correct without an answer key.
ziddoap 4y ago
>I think it's also a major waste of time to complain about it. Why's that? People are obviously taking time out of their day to read the complaint, and a non-zero amount of those people may be in a position to enact some small changes. >Let me put it this way - you are not entitled to a high-earning FAANG job. Not once reading this entire thing did I feel like the author felt entitled to a high-earning FAANG job. They actually make it pretty explicitly clear that they are talking about non-FAANG companies employing FAANG-style (or, what those non-FAANG companies think is FAANG-style) interviews. And it's still pretty clear, to me at least, that the author doesn't feel entitled to those jobs either. >You feel like it's a waste of time to learn Leetcode questions? Then don't do it. Case closed. That's... That's what they did. And they wrote about it.
paulcole 4y ago
Kind of an extension of this is that Facebook isn't looking for qualified developers. They're looking for qualified developers who will bend over backward to make a pile of money. And many non-Facebook employers are looking for qualified developers who will bend over backward to make a much smaller pile of money. They might be making a bad decision, but it's their bad decision to make.
CyanLite2 4y ago
I think OP is saying that 99.9999% of the other companies aren't FAANG even though they pretend to be. Their use case is displaying JPG images, not creating a new JPG algorithm. You don't need multi-dimensional array manipulation leetcode hard problems to do that. Yet their interview process is geared around that, and the recruiters/management don't know enough to know to make a useful decision. And then everybody complains "Oh, we can't find competent talent. Give us more visa openings!". But the free market eventually is taking care of those companies. You're seeing major layoffs in the crypto industry because they overhired on leetcoders and apparently not enough people who could help them turn a profit.
- mnd999 4y ago
  To be fair most of the people employed at FAANGs are just moving things between protocol buffers and hash maps and back again. They just make the interview hard because they pay a high salary and get too many applicants.
  - jrockway 4y ago
    Isn't that all any computer program is? Every AAA game is just moving input from the keyboard and mouse to the video card and network. The devil is in the details, of course.
    - mdm12 4y ago
      Yes, this trivialization of modern software development is annoying. Yes, we are modern-day plumbers. Turns out, plumbing can be hard.
      - leaflets2 4y ago
        I don't think so but cars are easy: just some rubber wheels glued to a steel chassi, and batteries. Shouldn't be allowed to be so expensive
- diehunde 4y ago
  People complaining about interviews should be more explicit about the companies they interviewed for. It might not be a FAANG company, but what if it's a database company? Or an MLOps company? Or even a gaming company. They need SWE with good algorithm and data structure skills too.
Chinjut 4y ago
Of course interviewers are entitled to or able to do these kinds of interviews. That doesn't mean one can't complain about it, and thereby hope to shift attitudes to where they change what they do. There'd be little to talk about or do if we could never describe ways in which we want things to change. This person is themself entitled to complain, and yet here you are complaining about them complaining (which you are entitled to as well).
yodsanklai 4y ago
It took me 5 tries over the span of 3 years to land a lucrative job at a FAANG. The effort I put in was very well spent and is minimal compared to other types of exams (law, medicine...). That being said, this is survivor bias and I understand it would be very frustrating to work on the preparation and not get a position in return. But to those who don't like the process, they have many other companies to choose from.
the_only_law 4y ago
> think it's also a major waste of time to complain about it About as much as complaining about complaining.
dchftcs 4y ago
This is a very naive and unconstructive point of view. Interviewers have an interest to screen for the best quality with the least effort. If they can reduce false negatives, they could fill positions more quickly. If there's a concensus a particular method is always better than asking for leetcode hards in 30 minutes, companies are likely to adopt it. Companies that adopt better practices perform better, and hopefully there's less time spent by people on practising leetcoding and more time spent on more productive activities. Nothing would be done if these conversations are not had. Many fail to make a difference, but sometimes something good comes out of it. You should learn to have some humility that many privileges that you currently enjoy are won by people who care and try and you should not shut them down. And as a practical matter, industry insiders do read these complaints. Sure, it's hard to make big companies change what they do. But companies do adapt. Many small companies adopted alternative practices that are less heavy on leetcode and hire well. With some time and effort, maybe big companies would change too, and we could all be better off.

by rocgf 4y ago

Clubber 4y ago

>you are not entitled to a high-earning FAANG job. It's really that simple. He's not talking about FAANG jobs. He's talking about Joe Blow companies that pays "market rates," and "great benefits!" to code really boring stuff with no highlights on the resume. He said these companies are too lazy to research any references and are just copy/pasta leetcode tests to their interviewees; tests the hiring people probably can't even validate as correct without an answer key.

ziddoap 4y ago

>I think it's also a major waste of time to complain about it. Why's that? People are obviously taking time out of their day to read the complaint, and a non-zero amount of those people may be in a position to enact some small changes. >Let me put it this way - you are not entitled to a high-earning FAANG job. Not once reading this entire thing did I feel like the author felt entitled to a high-earning FAANG job. They actually make it pretty explicitly clear that they are talking about non-FAANG companies employing FAANG-style (or, what those non-FAANG companies think is FAANG-style) interviews. And it's still pretty clear, to me at least, that the author doesn't feel entitled to those jobs either. >You feel like it's a waste of time to learn Leetcode questions? Then don't do it. Case closed. That's... That's what they did. And they wrote about it.

paulcole 4y ago

Kind of an extension of this is that Facebook isn't looking for qualified developers. They're looking for qualified developers who will bend over backward to make a pile of money. And many non-Facebook employers are looking for qualified developers who will bend over backward to make a much smaller pile of money. They might be making a bad decision, but it's their bad decision to make.

CyanLite2 4y ago

I think OP is saying that 99.9999% of the other companies aren't FAANG even though they pretend to be. Their use case is displaying JPG images, not creating a new JPG algorithm. You don't need multi-dimensional array manipulation leetcode hard problems to do that. Yet their interview process is geared around that, and the recruiters/management don't know enough to know to make a useful decision. And then everybody complains "Oh, we can't find competent talent. Give us more visa openings!". But the free market eventually is taking care of those companies. You're seeing major layoffs in the crypto industry because they overhired on leetcoders and apparently not enough people who could help them turn a profit.

mnd999 4y ago
To be fair most of the people employed at FAANGs are just moving things between protocol buffers and hash maps and back again. They just make the interview hard because they pay a high salary and get too many applicants.
- jrockway 4y ago
  Isn't that all any computer program is? Every AAA game is just moving input from the keyboard and mouse to the video card and network. The devil is in the details, of course.
  - mdm12 4y ago
    Yes, this trivialization of modern software development is annoying. Yes, we are modern-day plumbers. Turns out, plumbing can be hard.
    - leaflets2 4y ago
      I don't think so but cars are easy: just some rubber wheels glued to a steel chassi, and batteries. Shouldn't be allowed to be so expensive
diehunde 4y ago
People complaining about interviews should be more explicit about the companies they interviewed for. It might not be a FAANG company, but what if it's a database company? Or an MLOps company? Or even a gaming company. They need SWE with good algorithm and data structure skills too.

Chinjut 4y ago

Of course interviewers are entitled to or able to do these kinds of interviews. That doesn't mean one can't complain about it, and thereby hope to shift attitudes to where they change what they do. There'd be little to talk about or do if we could never describe ways in which we want things to change. This person is themself entitled to complain, and yet here you are complaining about them complaining (which you are entitled to as well).

yodsanklai 4y ago

It took me 5 tries over the span of 3 years to land a lucrative job at a FAANG. The effort I put in was very well spent and is minimal compared to other types of exams (law, medicine...). That being said, this is survivor bias and I understand it would be very frustrating to work on the preparation and not get a position in return. But to those who don't like the process, they have many other companies to choose from.

the_only_law 4y ago

> think it's also a major waste of time to complain about it About as much as complaining about complaining.

dchftcs 4y ago

This is a very naive and unconstructive point of view. Interviewers have an interest to screen for the best quality with the least effort. If they can reduce false negatives, they could fill positions more quickly. If there's a concensus a particular method is always better than asking for leetcode hards in 30 minutes, companies are likely to adopt it. Companies that adopt better practices perform better, and hopefully there's less time spent by people on practising leetcoding and more time spent on more productive activities. Nothing would be done if these conversations are not had. Many fail to make a difference, but sometimes something good comes out of it. You should learn to have some humility that many privileges that you currently enjoy are won by people who care and try and you should not shut them down. And as a practical matter, industry insiders do read these complaints. Sure, it's hard to make big companies change what they do. But companies do adapt. Many small companies adopted alternative practices that are less heavy on leetcode and hire well. With some time and effort, maybe big companies would change too, and we could all be better off.