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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guano#Bird_guano https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guano#Bird_guano

• pfdietz 4y ago
  So? The N still has to come from somewhere. The natural sources of N (nitrogen fixing plants, NOx from lightning or natural combustion), filtered through the birds, will not come anywhere close to what synthetic fertilizers can supply. As many as 80% of the N atoms in your body were fixed artificially by the Haber-Bosch process. Natural sources, using pigeons or not, are not up to the task.
  • Valgrim 4y ago
    Nitrogen fixation occurs naturally in the soil by bacteria. As the nitrogen is consumed by different species up from one trophic level to another, from plants to insects to bird, the nitrogen gets more and more concentrated. Birds are fairly high up the food chain, and their excrements are very rich in various nutrients, including nitrogen, phosphorus and potassium. The Haber Process is faster but requires a lot of energy, and provides no phosphorus or potassium, so you have to source it elsewhere. Also it requires no technology and can be installed pretty much anywhere.
    • analog31 4y ago
      I suspect that this can work for low intensity farming, like fruits and vegetables, but if you want to feed the cattle of the earth, you'll end up running out of pigeon food.
      • ungamedplayer 4y ago
        If you want to feed all the people of the earth, you will run out of pigeon food. Ecosystems contribute to food inputs for food consumers.
        • jay_kyburz 4y ago
          One of the best solutions to out fossil fuel problems is to simply have less people. We need to dramatically reduce the number of humans. Perhaps then the pigeons can help. ps: I recommend we let current humans die of old age, and make less new ones. Not attempt to get rid of humans already here.
          • giantg2 4y ago
            Given that our economies are built off of the idea of infinite growth and increases in consumption, there's likely to be conflict involved.
          • hawk_ 4y ago
            I'd phrase it as "reduce the number of mouths to feed". That way it could be achieved by reducing the amount of cattle grown for meat and we could eat more grains etc... ourselves instead of feeding those intermediaries.
          • Jistern 4y ago
            >> One of the best solutions to out fossil fuel problems Mankind has survived just fine since ancient times without burning anywhere near the amount of fossil fuels burned over, say, the last 200 years. With wind and solar, we are an the cusp of extremely cheap electricity. >> is to simply have less people. Feel free to follow your own advice.
    • pfdietz 4y ago
      Yes, nitrogen fixation occurs naturally. But the amount fixed is insufficient to achieve the yields of modern industrial agriculture on a global scale.
  • danielheath 4y ago
    Pigeon shit has existed for a little while longer than the H-B process has. Pigeons transport N from non-farmed areas (like forests) to farmed areas (where the towers are).
  • giantg2 4y ago
    "Natural sources, using pigeons or not, are not up to the task." Sure they are. Just not on the current scale (for the current processes and preferences). It raises an interesting question about how many people the earth can sustainably support though.