3 ms·

It does exist, it's just you completely have to pay out of pocket, and if you opt out of it as a doctor, you cannot take any public healthcare system patients e

by novok 4y ago

It does exist, it's just you completely have to pay out of pocket, and if you opt out of it as a doctor, you cannot take any public healthcare system patients either, which means your limited to a few rich people 'executive health' checkups and such. It's a complete either / or system. 'benefits' that cover the few items not covered by the public system also typically do not cover such non-public doctor visits either. Usage is so rare that most Canadians are unaware of such things. Canada has a family doctor crisis because they barely pay them, flat out. Often a pure family doctor doesn't even hit $200k, so any med student today is going to go some specialty route. It needs to equalize with walk-in clinic rates or it will continue to not have good supply.

nicoburns 4y ago
$200k!! (presumably Canadian Dollars, which works out at ~£126k). Here in the UK a typical GP salary is ~90k, and while we do have trouble retaining doctors that is almost entirely due to working conditions (hospitals and practices are understaffed so medical staff end up overworked). I've only very rarely heard doctors complain that they are underpaid. I can definitely see that rates ought to equalised across different medical career paths though.
- stormbrew 4y ago
  I'm not really sure about other parts of the country (health care delivery is a provincial responsibility so beware any "health care in canada is X" take: they likely really mean Ontario or maybe Quebec or BC), but the part I live in (Alberta, home of #3 on this list) has a family doctor crisis that's more complicated than just yearly pay. It's a combination of: - A government that is outright hostile to health care workers, including fighting a battle against their unions during covid to reduce pay. The health minister famously went to a doctor's home and berated him from the driveway for tweeting something negative about him. Again, during the pandemic. - Some specific changes to the pay schedule for doctors that makes it very difficult for them to spend more than 15 minutes with any given patient without losing out on income. - The introduction a teledoctor system that pays better but most of the people on the other side of it don't live or work in the province. And that's ignoring other kinds of medical workers, where they've done various things to force specialists to take on fewer patients, cut nursing headcounts to the bone, etc. Every medical professional I've interacted with for the last few years (even before the pandemic) has seemed exhausted and on the verge of packing up and leaving.
- novok 4y ago
  The pay averages around $130-$140k canadian dollars. 90k GBP is about $140k CAD, which is about the same. A specialist makes around +$300k, a surgeon over $500k. Also it's about what the alternatives pay for a doctor. Becoming a specialist isn't that much more work, but pays significantly better. Also you can do equivalent work as a GP doctor working at walk in clinics / urgent care and get paid significantly more in the same city from the same healthcare system than being a traditional family doctor. It's kind of obvious why you don't have any family doctors with that kind of financial incentive system. The ones that do it do it out of inertia or really like being a family doctor for non-financial reasons. Another special thing about the UK although is the amount of schooling needed to become one and consummate expense and risk seems significantly less. You can enter doctor school after high school and be in school for a significantly less amount of time. If you don't get in, you can move on with your life and go do something else with nothing really spent time wise or financially. In the US/Canada, you need to get at least %75 of an undergrad, hope you get accepted into a graduate doctor school, which is extremely competitive, and then work you ass off in a very high workload situation, and then you need to do residency where your paid below minimum wage if you do an hours worked calculation, in a system designed by a doctor with a literal cocaine habit before cocaine was made illegal. Your in your 30s when you can start making proper money.

by novok 4y ago

nicoburns 4y ago

$200k!! (presumably Canadian Dollars, which works out at ~£126k). Here in the UK a typical GP salary is ~90k, and while we do have trouble retaining doctors that is almost entirely due to working conditions (hospitals and practices are understaffed so medical staff end up overworked). I've only very rarely heard doctors complain that they are underpaid. I can definitely see that rates ought to equalised across different medical career paths though.

stormbrew 4y ago
I'm not really sure about other parts of the country (health care delivery is a provincial responsibility so beware any "health care in canada is X" take: they likely really mean Ontario or maybe Quebec or BC), but the part I live in (Alberta, home of #3 on this list) has a family doctor crisis that's more complicated than just yearly pay. It's a combination of: - A government that is outright hostile to health care workers, including fighting a battle against their unions during covid to reduce pay. The health minister famously went to a doctor's home and berated him from the driveway for tweeting something negative about him. Again, during the pandemic. - Some specific changes to the pay schedule for doctors that makes it very difficult for them to spend more than 15 minutes with any given patient without losing out on income. - The introduction a teledoctor system that pays better but most of the people on the other side of it don't live or work in the province. And that's ignoring other kinds of medical workers, where they've done various things to force specialists to take on fewer patients, cut nursing headcounts to the bone, etc. Every medical professional I've interacted with for the last few years (even before the pandemic) has seemed exhausted and on the verge of packing up and leaving.
novok 4y ago
The pay averages around $130-$140k canadian dollars. 90k GBP is about $140k CAD, which is about the same. A specialist makes around +$300k, a surgeon over $500k. Also it's about what the alternatives pay for a doctor. Becoming a specialist isn't that much more work, but pays significantly better. Also you can do equivalent work as a GP doctor working at walk in clinics / urgent care and get paid significantly more in the same city from the same healthcare system than being a traditional family doctor. It's kind of obvious why you don't have any family doctors with that kind of financial incentive system. The ones that do it do it out of inertia or really like being a family doctor for non-financial reasons. Another special thing about the UK although is the amount of schooling needed to become one and consummate expense and risk seems significantly less. You can enter doctor school after high school and be in school for a significantly less amount of time. If you don't get in, you can move on with your life and go do something else with nothing really spent time wise or financially. In the US/Canada, you need to get at least %75 of an undergrad, hope you get accepted into a graduate doctor school, which is extremely competitive, and then work you ass off in a very high workload situation, and then you need to do residency where your paid below minimum wage if you do an hours worked calculation, in a system designed by a doctor with a literal cocaine habit before cocaine was made illegal. Your in your 30s when you can start making proper money.