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> So the message is clear - shifting to a more plant-base diet is the single biggest way an individual can do to reduce their environmental impact. A "more pla

> So the message is clear - shifting to a more plant-base diet is the single biggest way an individual can do to reduce their environmental impact. A "more plant-based diet" is not a vegan diet and no environmental organisation is saying that everyone should go vegan to save the planet. But we've been through all this already. > So the point is - these products will help people who like chicken nuggets or burgers - transition to a more plant-based diet. And keep them for ever in the thrall of a food industry that wants to sell them shit and that doesn't give a flying fig about the environment, about animal rights, or about peoples' health or culture. The food industry is responsible for the destruction of the environment and the torture of animals that you pretend to care so much about. It is responsible for the destruction of food cultures and for the destruction of farmers' livelihoods and way of life. And yet, you are very happy to cheer this same food industry on when it produces more industrial shit just because they don't have meat in them? Why? Because you don't really care about the environment, about animal suffering, or about peoples' lives. That's why. You only care about one singular subject: meat. Meat meat meat meat meat. That's all you can think about. > The way you argued and the way you continue to ignore scientific evidence points to an 'intense uncritical devotion' and you choosing your current username - cheese_goddess - seems to suggest you match this line 'exhibiting excessive enthusiasm'. Pfffhahaha. That's just a laughable attempt to try and turn the tables on me. It doesn't work because I don't have any ideology, I'm not the one trying to tell people what to do, or not do, and I'm not the one trying to guilt trip people into accepting my ideology. And I'm not the one who is trying to twist science and activism to my own ends. But you are. Because you're a fanatic, a zealot, a follower, a cult member. You don't like it? Get used to it.

uxcolumbo 4y ago
> no environmental organisation is saying that everyone should go vegan to save the planet. Where did I say that? I would suggest you read more carefully and not just place words in other people's mouths. I said a 'more plant-based diet', which means a reduction in meat consumption. And guess what - if more people would choose to follow this advice given by those organizations listed previously - it would mean fewer animals would have to be killed, which in turn means less cruelty towards animals overall and environmental destruction, i.e. a more vegan planet. And read the official definition of veganism I posted earlier. It's not dogmatic, but rather promotes pragmatism. It says to avoid exploiting animals when practically possible, which means that it's unavoidable to eat meat when you need it to survive and there are no other foods available. > The food industry is responsible for the destruction of the environment Yes agreed. Our food system is not sustainable - that's why it needs to change. > Because you don't really care about the environment, about animal suffering, or about peoples' lives. If I don't care about animal suffering or the environment, why have I given up supporting the meat & dairy industry and stopped consuming their products? Doesn't make sense, does it? > Pfffhahaha. That's just a laughable attempt to try and turn the tables on me. How am I turning the tables? You called me a fanatic and being part of a cult. I merely explained, based on the official definition of fanatic - your behavior and comments show traits of being a fanatic, someone who isn't able to shift their opinion, even if there is ample evidence to show their opinion is flawed. Your opinion seems to be a) meat industry doesn't destroy the environment, b) animals don't suffer or feel pain. > It doesn't work because I don't have any ideology Definition of Ideology: "a manner or the content of thinking characteristic of an individual, group, or culture" Based on your comments, your ideology seems to be that animals are here to serve us, it's OK to exploit and kill them regardless of consequences. It's OK for them to suffer so we can have our cheese & meat. Tradition trumps logic and critical thinking. Many people have that view about animals - so wouldn't you say you're part of that group - sharing the same content of thinking? > You only care about one singular subject: meat. Meat meat meat meat meat. What do you mean? I don't follow. I mentioned several subjects. So for your benefit, let me list them again: - Protecting the Environment - Animal rights - not taking their life against their will - Not supporting an industry that makes factory farm workers suffer from PTSD > But you are. Because you're a fanatic, a zealot, a follower, a cult member. You don't like it? Get used to it. So a 'follower' of scientific evidence means I'm part of a cult and I'm a fanatic? A fanatic usually doesn't change their opinion when presented with evidence. Show me the evidence that: A) animal factory farming doesn't create environmental damage B) animals are like plants - i.e. animals don't suffer and that's why it's OK to kill and exploit them. I used to eat meat when I was a teenager - but then changed my opinion when I saw what damage my eating habits caused. Sorry to say this, but the term fanatic applies more to your current behavior - as you ignore the evidence.
- cheese_goddess 4y ago
  You know, I didn't realise you 're the same looney tune character I've been interacting with upthread, but in retrospect, given the torrent of words and the snotty style, I should have figured it out earlier. My bad.
  - uxcolumbo 4y ago
    Definition of snotty: "spitefully unpleasant" Please explain how my replies were spitefully unpleasant? I'm trying to have a meaningful debate. I presented you with ample evidence - even your own articles you posted and yet you've not answered most of my questions. Instead you resort to snotty comments like this one.

uxcolumbo 4y ago

> no environmental organisation is saying that everyone should go vegan to save the planet. Where did I say that? I would suggest you read more carefully and not just place words in other people's mouths. I said a 'more plant-based diet', which means a reduction in meat consumption. And guess what - if more people would choose to follow this advice given by those organizations listed previously - it would mean fewer animals would have to be killed, which in turn means less cruelty towards animals overall and environmental destruction, i.e. a more vegan planet. And read the official definition of veganism I posted earlier. It's not dogmatic, but rather promotes pragmatism. It says to avoid exploiting animals when practically possible, which means that it's unavoidable to eat meat when you need it to survive and there are no other foods available. > The food industry is responsible for the destruction of the environment Yes agreed. Our food system is not sustainable - that's why it needs to change. > Because you don't really care about the environment, about animal suffering, or about peoples' lives. If I don't care about animal suffering or the environment, why have I given up supporting the meat & dairy industry and stopped consuming their products? Doesn't make sense, does it? > Pfffhahaha. That's just a laughable attempt to try and turn the tables on me. How am I turning the tables? You called me a fanatic and being part of a cult. I merely explained, based on the official definition of fanatic - your behavior and comments show traits of being a fanatic, someone who isn't able to shift their opinion, even if there is ample evidence to show their opinion is flawed. Your opinion seems to be a) meat industry doesn't destroy the environment, b) animals don't suffer or feel pain. > It doesn't work because I don't have any ideology Definition of Ideology: "a manner or the content of thinking characteristic of an individual, group, or culture" Based on your comments, your ideology seems to be that animals are here to serve us, it's OK to exploit and kill them regardless of consequences. It's OK for them to suffer so we can have our cheese & meat. Tradition trumps logic and critical thinking. Many people have that view about animals - so wouldn't you say you're part of that group - sharing the same content of thinking? > You only care about one singular subject: meat. Meat meat meat meat meat. What do you mean? I don't follow. I mentioned several subjects. So for your benefit, let me list them again: - Protecting the Environment - Animal rights - not taking their life against their will - Not supporting an industry that makes factory farm workers suffer from PTSD > But you are. Because you're a fanatic, a zealot, a follower, a cult member. You don't like it? Get used to it. So a 'follower' of scientific evidence means I'm part of a cult and I'm a fanatic? A fanatic usually doesn't change their opinion when presented with evidence. Show me the evidence that: A) animal factory farming doesn't create environmental damage B) animals are like plants - i.e. animals don't suffer and that's why it's OK to kill and exploit them. I used to eat meat when I was a teenager - but then changed my opinion when I saw what damage my eating habits caused. Sorry to say this, but the term fanatic applies more to your current behavior - as you ignore the evidence.

cheese_goddess 4y ago
You know, I didn't realise you 're the same looney tune character I've been interacting with upthread, but in retrospect, given the torrent of words and the snotty style, I should have figured it out earlier. My bad.
- uxcolumbo 4y ago
  Definition of snotty: "spitefully unpleasant" Please explain how my replies were spitefully unpleasant? I'm trying to have a meaningful debate. I presented you with ample evidence - even your own articles you posted and yet you've not answered most of my questions. Instead you resort to snotty comments like this one.