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I strongly recommend reading Ruth Bader Ginsberg’s thoughts on Roe v Wade in 1992 - expressed about a year before she became a Supreme Court justice. She descr

I strongly recommend reading Ruth Bader Ginsberg’s thoughts on Roe v Wade in 1992 - expressed about a year before she became a Supreme Court justice. She describes Roe as a “breathtaking” decision and as interrupting a process already underway. Her discussion starts on page 1198 in this PDF which is a rewarding read if you have the time. I’m not advocating either way - I merely hope to present Justice Ginsbergs eloquent views (in 1992) on the matter for further discussion here. https://www.law.nyu.edu/sites/default/files/ECM_PRO_059254.pdf https://www.law.nyu.edu/sites/default/files/ECM_PRO_059254.p...

incomplete 4y ago
yeah, thanks for the link and i recall (from years ago) reading about her thoughts on the subject. roe v wade was a sweeping judgement that (depending on how you looked at it) guaranteed women's rights at the expense of state autonomy WRT laws. because of the states' rights issue, plus moral "conservatism", roe V wade was an easy target and i'm not surprised it was reversed. fwiw, i'm a lefty and think that this is a terrible decision w/consequences that won't take long to be felt around the country
- the_solenoid 4y ago
  It should have been codified into law decades ago, but EVERYONE with few exceptions loves to fundraise off of it. Want to know how you know the US will backslide? I Said it a decade ago - when R's are willing to pull the trigger on Roe, it will be because they are going for everything.
  - cryptonector 4y ago
    That's an overly dramatic take. My prediction is that Republicans will now begin losing seats in red State legislatures precisely because of this decision.
    - mgkimsal 4y ago
      'now begin' If it happens, and it's because of this decision, I don't think it'll be felt for a while. Certainly I don't expect any backlash this election cycle, and probably no real consequences from this in 2024. I suspect that, to the extent negative effects are felt from this, there will be years of blaming those effects on 'liberal policies' and demonizing democrats some more. I'm pessimistic, but think we'll have a generation before there's any real backlash against the Republican Party over this issue (and by then, the party largely won't look the same as it does today anyway).
      - cryptonector 4y ago
        It could be felt in November, or in 2024. 2026 at the latest.
    - 31835843 4y ago
    - lovich 4y ago
      The republicans have already indicated they are done with democracy. Why would they care if the voters don’t like it? They’ll just change the electors to whoever picks what they want
      - ryan93 4y ago
        No they wont
        lovich 4y ago
        They believe they can. They tried last election and they'll try again as they had zero fucking consequences. If you think they wont try you are either one of them or have your head in the sand. Edit: It was also frequently stated that "no, they wont" when people were worried about the conservatives overturning roe v wade, but here we are!
    - mikkergp 4y ago
  - dragonwriter 4y ago
    > It should have been codified into law decades ago, If its not a 14th Amendment right, what is the Constitutional basis for codification? An expansive view of the Commerce Clause? That’s…not going to fly with the same politico-judicial faction that would hold it isn’t protected by the 14th Amendment. Codification is a sideshow.
    - rufus_foreman 4y ago
      From Kavanaugh's concurrence: "On the question of abortion, the Constitution is therefore neither pro-life nor pro-choice. The Constitution is neutral and leaves the issue for the people and their elected representatives to resolve through the democratic process in the States or Congress — like the numerous other difficult questions of American social and economic policy that the Constitution does not address". ... "After today’s decision, the nine Members of this Court will no longer decide the basic legality of pre-viability abortion for all 330 million Americans. That issue will be resolved by the people and their representatives in the democratic process in the States or Congress."
  - GiorgioG 4y ago
    I'm disappointed with the decision, but it's an obvious reaction to what conservatives view as "the extreme left/progressives" pushing too far/hard. "...when the pendulum swings too far in one direction it will go back" (RBG) I'm an independent and I share many views with both R's and D's. However I can say that at the extremes of each party - they're fucking it all up for all of us.
  - thathndude 4y ago
    This is sadly true. Within one hour of the decision, I had spam text messages from both parties trying to raise money against the decision
permo-w 4y ago
this may come across as emotional, and I suspect it is, so feel free to downvote me. but that person, dead or alive, is completely non-grata to me. she is a big part to blame for allowing the court to become so heavily conservative. if she had stood down in Obama's early years, when she was asked to, it would be a 5-4 split, and a good chance that they wouldn't have had the balls to follow through with this
- Trasmatta 4y ago
  Agreed. RBG's refusal to step down was a massive blunder. She had too much of a cult of personality around her, and it went to her head.
- jonwithoutanh 4y ago
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- honkdaddy 4y ago
  I'll try my best to phrase this delicately, as I understand it's an emotional topic for Americans right now, but perhaps RBG chose not to step down because she knew that the action of stepping down was inherently political, and after years on the court, had decided to avoid setting a precedent of Blue/Red judges tactically stepping down when their respective party is in power. Who knows what her real reasoning may have been, but that's my interpretation.
  - thathndude 4y ago
    This is an interesting take I haven’t seen before. It is intriguing.
  - hklgny 4y ago
    That doesn’t change it from being a blunder since it IS inherently political and the consequences were the same.

incomplete 4y ago

yeah, thanks for the link and i recall (from years ago) reading about her thoughts on the subject. roe v wade was a sweeping judgement that (depending on how you looked at it) guaranteed women's rights at the expense of state autonomy WRT laws. because of the states' rights issue, plus moral "conservatism", roe V wade was an easy target and i'm not surprised it was reversed. fwiw, i'm a lefty and think that this is a terrible decision w/consequences that won't take long to be felt around the country

the_solenoid 4y ago
It should have been codified into law decades ago, but EVERYONE with few exceptions loves to fundraise off of it. Want to know how you know the US will backslide? I Said it a decade ago - when R's are willing to pull the trigger on Roe, it will be because they are going for everything.
- cryptonector 4y ago
  That's an overly dramatic take. My prediction is that Republicans will now begin losing seats in red State legislatures precisely because of this decision.
  - mgkimsal 4y ago
    'now begin' If it happens, and it's because of this decision, I don't think it'll be felt for a while. Certainly I don't expect any backlash this election cycle, and probably no real consequences from this in 2024. I suspect that, to the extent negative effects are felt from this, there will be years of blaming those effects on 'liberal policies' and demonizing democrats some more. I'm pessimistic, but think we'll have a generation before there's any real backlash against the Republican Party over this issue (and by then, the party largely won't look the same as it does today anyway).
    - cryptonector 4y ago
      It could be felt in November, or in 2024. 2026 at the latest.
  - 31835843 4y ago
  - lovich 4y ago
    The republicans have already indicated they are done with democracy. Why would they care if the voters don’t like it? They’ll just change the electors to whoever picks what they want
    - ryan93 4y ago
      No they wont
      - lovich 4y ago
        They believe they can. They tried last election and they'll try again as they had zero fucking consequences. If you think they wont try you are either one of them or have your head in the sand. Edit: It was also frequently stated that "no, they wont" when people were worried about the conservatives overturning roe v wade, but here we are!
  - mikkergp 4y ago
- dragonwriter 4y ago
  > It should have been codified into law decades ago, If its not a 14th Amendment right, what is the Constitutional basis for codification? An expansive view of the Commerce Clause? That’s…not going to fly with the same politico-judicial faction that would hold it isn’t protected by the 14th Amendment. Codification is a sideshow.
  - rufus_foreman 4y ago
    From Kavanaugh's concurrence: "On the question of abortion, the Constitution is therefore neither pro-life nor pro-choice. The Constitution is neutral and leaves the issue for the people and their elected representatives to resolve through the democratic process in the States or Congress — like the numerous other difficult questions of American social and economic policy that the Constitution does not address". ... "After today’s decision, the nine Members of this Court will no longer decide the basic legality of pre-viability abortion for all 330 million Americans. That issue will be resolved by the people and their representatives in the democratic process in the States or Congress."
- GiorgioG 4y ago
  I'm disappointed with the decision, but it's an obvious reaction to what conservatives view as "the extreme left/progressives" pushing too far/hard. "...when the pendulum swings too far in one direction it will go back" (RBG) I'm an independent and I share many views with both R's and D's. However I can say that at the extremes of each party - they're fucking it all up for all of us.
- thathndude 4y ago
  This is sadly true. Within one hour of the decision, I had spam text messages from both parties trying to raise money against the decision

permo-w 4y ago

this may come across as emotional, and I suspect it is, so feel free to downvote me. but that person, dead or alive, is completely non-grata to me. she is a big part to blame for allowing the court to become so heavily conservative. if she had stood down in Obama's early years, when she was asked to, it would be a 5-4 split, and a good chance that they wouldn't have had the balls to follow through with this

Trasmatta 4y ago
Agreed. RBG's refusal to step down was a massive blunder. She had too much of a cult of personality around her, and it went to her head.
jonwithoutanh 4y ago
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
honkdaddy 4y ago
I'll try my best to phrase this delicately, as I understand it's an emotional topic for Americans right now, but perhaps RBG chose not to step down because she knew that the action of stepping down was inherently political, and after years on the court, had decided to avoid setting a precedent of Blue/Red judges tactically stepping down when their respective party is in power. Who knows what her real reasoning may have been, but that's my interpretation.
- thathndude 4y ago
  This is an interesting take I haven’t seen before. It is intriguing.
- hklgny 4y ago
  That doesn’t change it from being a blunder since it IS inherently political and the consequences were the same.