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>This is trivially falsifiable: blockchains are being used to facilitate illegal transactions. yes, and so does the other crypto - cryptography. facilitating i

>This is trivially falsifiable: blockchains are being used to facilitate illegal transactions. yes, and so does the other crypto - cryptography. facilitating illegal transactions, illegal speech, illegal opinions, illegal thoughts. list of users includes terrorists, drug dealers, pedophiles, Russians, antivaxers and so on. it boggles me how do people fail still fail to understand, after watching our collective liberty being eroded for the past 20 years in the name of combating terrorists and protecting children, that the slippery slope is not a fallacy but a law of nature. the people and entities who want cryptocurrency gone don't give a flying fuck about things they feed the useful idiots as the rationale to do it.

hnthrow1010 4y ago
But that isn't answering the question. You're just saying blockchains are good "because slippery slope" without mentioning what they actually do.
- jazzyjackson 4y ago
  I thought their answer was very clear: facilitates illegal transactions this is a good thing because tyrannical governments make all kinds of things illegal, and blockchain removes some of this absolute power to prevent various transactions
  - hnthrow1010 4y ago
    Speaking as someone who has been harmed by ransomware, no, it is very much not a good thing. But presuming it was a good thing that I get my data held for ransom, there's no explanation as to why blockchains are uniquely suited to remove some of that absolute power. They appear to be no different from any other illegal digital banking scheme, such as Liberty Reserve: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liberty_Reserve https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liberty_Reserve Specifically, the "product" is they've assembled a criminal conspiracy to launder money and hide fraud, and they're offering it as a service. When you have sophisticated scammers running them it always takes time for regulators to unravel these schemes; blockchains certainly did not invent this.
    - gfodor 4y ago
      > "in some cases, transacting against the law is a good thing" > "as a victim of ransomware, it is very much not a good thing" Blatantly fallacious argument, the point isn't to defend ransomware, but to defend other examples of illegality that are justified.
    - throwaway0x7E6 4y ago
      another great argument in favor of banning cryptography. no encryption - no ransomware
      - randomhodler84 4y ago
        Indeed! We should also ban crime too, that will surely stop it. Why not get rid of general purpose computation and global communication networks while we are torching our technological footprint.
        throwaway0x7E6 4y ago
        the Internet is here to stay. too useful for commerce and disseminating propaganda globally. it will remain, in some perverse walled-garden form general purpose computation though... I feel it's already on the chopping block. I think we'll see the first signs during the upcoming "cyber pandemic".
        randomhodler84 4y ago
        They will take my intels amd and rpis from my cold dead hands!
        hnthrow1010 4y ago
        If you're caught committing crimes (like for instance, using the computers to arrange transactions of human trafficking) and you invoke a standoff and shootout with the police, then yes, they probably will. That's true with or without blockchains. And because I can see where this is going: The takes along the lines of "it's not illegal, I was just flipping some electrons into ones and zeros" is a really bad take, you can do better than that.
  - cecilpl2 4y ago
    Non-tyrannical governments (ie most governments) also make very harmful things illegal for very good reasons, and a system which can facilitate these harmful things is in itself a harmful thing. I don't know how you can argue that facilitating illegal transactions is on balance a good thing, unless you also argue that the world would be better off if all currently-illegal transactions were instead legal.
    - randomhodler84 4y ago
      The problem is where does one determine the point of tyranny? You will find that even the most apparently benign governments can turn given the political will of elected tyrants. I’d say a government that outlaws abortion is a tyrannical overlord with no legitimacy. And yet here we are.

hnthrow1010 4y ago

But that isn't answering the question. You're just saying blockchains are good "because slippery slope" without mentioning what they actually do.

jazzyjackson 4y ago
I thought their answer was very clear: facilitates illegal transactions this is a good thing because tyrannical governments make all kinds of things illegal, and blockchain removes some of this absolute power to prevent various transactions
- hnthrow1010 4y ago
  Speaking as someone who has been harmed by ransomware, no, it is very much not a good thing. But presuming it was a good thing that I get my data held for ransom, there's no explanation as to why blockchains are uniquely suited to remove some of that absolute power. They appear to be no different from any other illegal digital banking scheme, such as Liberty Reserve: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liberty_Reserve https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liberty_Reserve Specifically, the "product" is they've assembled a criminal conspiracy to launder money and hide fraud, and they're offering it as a service. When you have sophisticated scammers running them it always takes time for regulators to unravel these schemes; blockchains certainly did not invent this.
  - gfodor 4y ago
    > "in some cases, transacting against the law is a good thing" > "as a victim of ransomware, it is very much not a good thing" Blatantly fallacious argument, the point isn't to defend ransomware, but to defend other examples of illegality that are justified.
  - throwaway0x7E6 4y ago
    another great argument in favor of banning cryptography. no encryption - no ransomware
    - randomhodler84 4y ago
      Indeed! We should also ban crime too, that will surely stop it. Why not get rid of general purpose computation and global communication networks while we are torching our technological footprint.
      - throwaway0x7E6 4y ago
        the Internet is here to stay. too useful for commerce and disseminating propaganda globally. it will remain, in some perverse walled-garden form general purpose computation though... I feel it's already on the chopping block. I think we'll see the first signs during the upcoming "cyber pandemic".
        randomhodler84 4y ago
        They will take my intels amd and rpis from my cold dead hands!
        hnthrow1010 4y ago
        If you're caught committing crimes (like for instance, using the computers to arrange transactions of human trafficking) and you invoke a standoff and shootout with the police, then yes, they probably will. That's true with or without blockchains. And because I can see where this is going: The takes along the lines of "it's not illegal, I was just flipping some electrons into ones and zeros" is a really bad take, you can do better than that.
- cecilpl2 4y ago
  Non-tyrannical governments (ie most governments) also make very harmful things illegal for very good reasons, and a system which can facilitate these harmful things is in itself a harmful thing. I don't know how you can argue that facilitating illegal transactions is on balance a good thing, unless you also argue that the world would be better off if all currently-illegal transactions were instead legal.
  - randomhodler84 4y ago
    The problem is where does one determine the point of tyranny? You will find that even the most apparently benign governments can turn given the political will of elected tyrants. I’d say a government that outlaws abortion is a tyrannical overlord with no legitimacy. And yet here we are.