4 ms·
Democratized access to money means that I can move my life savings as a refugee from a war torn country by just remembering 24 words. Access to a bank account d
by j0hnyl 4y ago
Democratized access to money means that I can move my life savings as a refugee from a war torn country by just remembering 24 words. Access to a bank account doesn't preclude this need. Think corrupt countries like Ukraine or even Cambodia, Laos. There are banks, but they go belly up every week and new ones come up. If you think outside of the narrow scope of the first world, there are many unbanked folks that can benefit.
As for the rich affording tx fees, maybe a replacement for daily cash isn't everyone's use case? Maybe it doesn't have to be bitcoin? It can be one of many other cryptocurrencies that has low tx fees. There are places in the world where the volatility of crypto looks stable in comparison to the local geo-political and financial climate.
Cryptocurrencies offer the world a "splinter economy".
Having said all that, of course this stuff is not without issues that need addressing. Regulating this technology into oblivion isn't it though.
- hnthrow1010 4y ago>Democratized access to money means that I can move my life savings as a refugee from a war torn country This has nothing to do with cryptocurrencies, blockchains, or "democratized access" at all. What you're suggesting is simply for people to use foreign banks. If your local money is being destabilized by war, I can't see why you'd want to put your money into an extremely volatile offshore casino, which is what cryptocurrency is.
- randomhodler84 4y agoNow we are getting closer to home. I don’t trust banks, they have robbed me my entire life. Have you ever interacted with foreign banks?
- hnthrow1010 4y agoWhat you're saying makes no sense, storing your money in crypto is like putting it in a even less trustworthy foreign bank.
- randomhodler84 4y agoSo I must really distrust banks then, eh! I know the usefulness of state-free money. I’ve lived it. You are just trying to worship at the feet of Authority.
- hnthrow1010 4y agoMany things wrong with that: - Cryptocurrency is not state-free money. Among other things, it requires functioning infrastructure, stable electricity and internet available at affordable prices. These things are provided by the government everywhere on earth. - Cryptocurrency is not authority-free. Actually, you're trusting several authorities any time you interact with any blockchains. - I'm not denying you got use out of cryptocurrency. I'm sure you did. At first glance it does appear to be some kind of functioning financial system, but it is not. A lot of other people have also lost significant amounts of money with it.
- randomhodler84 4y agoElectricity and internet access are typically private sector commodities and services. There is often still internet without Government. Which authorities? I signed a tx, sent it to the swarm using free and open source software, and it was included in a block. Trustless. No authority. I’m sure lots of people gained and lost fortunes. It’s fine. The trade off is worth it.
- hnthrow1010 4y agoNo, laying out a power grid is very much not a private sector thing. In most stable countries, the grid is either operated outright by the government or the government leases the grid out to the private sector. The same thing is true with the internet cabling. >Trustless. No authority. This is very, very wrong. It's another one of those marketing lines repeated by blockchain companies that is blatantly wrong if you look into it even just a little. At minimum, you need to trust the "swarm" that you just mentioned. It's effectively acting as the authority and you're trusting it to make the right decisions. And if the swarm goes away, you can't make your transactions anymore; the value of your tokens will drop to zero. >The trade off is worth it. To this date, no one has been able to explain to me clearly what this trade off is. "It's trustless" is not a trade off, that's not communicating what the actual benefit is. And it's also just wrong.
- elil17 4y agoHmm, you’ve been robbed by banks? That sounds like a big deal, you should file a report with the inspector general of the FDIC if you’re US based: https://www.fdicoig.gov/ https://www.fdicoig.gov/
- randomhodler84 4y agoNot US banks. Several countries have confiscated bank funds in the last 10y, in fact my place of birth changed the law that untouched bank accounts within 3y get confiscated by the State. This is a major western nation btw. But since then, I don’t leave enough fiat with banks (including US) banks that they are in a place to rob me. I trust in ECDSA and Schnorr signatures about 100x as much as I trust FDIC.
- hnthrow1010 4y agoAnd several crypto exchanges/lenders have totally collapsed or rug pulled in the last 10 years. Trusting crypto is not "trusting ECDSA and Schnorr" any more than you would be trusting the bank to use those same algorithms, you still are trusting an entire ecosystem of known bad actors. Do you really think those banks that confiscated funds don't encrypt their traffic?
- randomhodler84 4y agoYes, and I tell people not to store on exchanges, take custody of their coin. There is no bank in Bitcoin! Agree, there is risk for the 5 minutes it takes to transfer the coins out. If you are on boarding from fiat, there is a degree of trust to extend to the exchange. But this is not Bitcoin, it is a centralized exchange. There are other ways to buy and trade coin too. Earning is best. I knew not to leave coins with MtGox. I knew not to leave them with Cryptsy. This is a lesson I learned from banks. Can you elaborate how a bad actor, any bad actor, can confiscate, steal, reorder or devalue a UTXO recorded on an immutable blockchain for all eternity?
- hnthrow1010 4y ago
- j0hnyl 4y agoOk, but how?
- angio 4y agoIt's incredibly difficult to open a bank account in a "stable" country from a developing country, but anyone can open an account on Binance and then transfer the crypto to their own wallet.
- hnthrow1010 4y agoThat's only because Binance is just operating as an unregulated bank there. It is also extremely easy to lose all your money that way because the coin you chose to transact in plummeted, or the exchange decided to freeze your account, or the exchange becomes insolvent and decided to halt withdrawals, or your country decided to start blocking that exchange due to massive fraud, or you simply lose your private keys...
- dghlsakjg 4y agoYou mention Ukraine, Cambodia and Lao. None of those countries is particularly corrupt. But its worth noting that the current rate of inflation for BTC/ETH is far higher than any of those countries. Another way of framing it is that crypto currencies are less stable than a currency from a country that is actively under attack from a nuclear superpower.
- j0hnyl 4y agoThese countries are insanely unstable in a lot of ways to the point that it's hard for the average joe to move "significant to them" sums of money out of them. Furthermore, you need to pay serious bribes to operate a business. Privacy forward blockchains can help with that.
- simonw 4y ago"just remembering 24 words" Really hope you don't get a concussion on your way out of that warzone!
- HWR_14 4y ago> Democratized access to money means that I can move my life savings as a refugee from a war torn country by just remembering 24 words It also means if I know your 24 words I can take your life savings and you'll never be able to get it back. Which means I can coerce you as you cross the borders as a refugee and take everything.