3 ms·

the open borders come from Shengen agreement not the EU. You can drive through switzerland no problem

malermeister 4y ago
And the Schengen agreement is EU law :-) That's like saying free speech in the US comes from the 1st amendment, not the constitution.
- paganel 4y ago
  Not in Romania, it isn’t (nor in Bulgaria). I should know, as I’m from Romania.
  - malermeister 4y ago
    As part of the aforementioned EU law, there's a list of countries to which it applies. The two you've mentioned aren't on it. You can look it up in the Amsterdam treaty if you'd like :) edit: here's the law for your convenience: https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/SK/TXT/?uri=CELEX:11997D/PRO/02 https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/SK/TXT/?uri=CELEX:11...
    - paganel 4y ago
      So an EU law that doesn’t apply to the whole EU, that bodes well for a confederate project.
      - malermeister 4y ago
        Isn't that what the article is arguing for though? A multi-speed Europe?
        paganel 4y ago
        Count of disingenuous to argue for a multi-speed Europe starting from now on when we have been a multi-speed Europe already. I'd be perfectly fine with that, too, but getting rid of the unanimity thingie is just asking for trouble.
guerrilla 4y ago
> It was signed on 14 June 1985, near the town of Schengen, Luxembourg, by five of the ten member states of the then European Economic Community. > Originally, the Schengen treaties and the rules adopted under them operated independently from the European Union. However, in 1999 they were incorporated into European Union law by the Amsterdam Treaty, while providing opt-outs for the only two EU member states that had remained outside the Area: Ireland and the United Kingdom (which subsequently withdrew from the EU in 2020). Schengen is now a core part of EU law, and all EU member states without an opt-out which have not already joined the Schengen Area are legally obliged to do so when technical requirements have been met. Several non-EU countries are included in the area through special association agreements.
kmonsen 4y ago
You are right, and wrong. You cannot drive through Switzerland (I lived there for two years so have personal experience) without showing passport. It works some of the time, but they do checks. For me it has been perhaps 25% of the time entering Switzerland I was stopped and passport for everyone in the car was checked. This was on a Swiss registered car with Swiss highway sticker on.

And the Schengen agreement is EU law :-) That's like saying free speech in the US comes from the 1st amendment, not the constitution.

paganel 4y ago
Not in Romania, it isn’t (nor in Bulgaria). I should know, as I’m from Romania.
- malermeister 4y ago
  As part of the aforementioned EU law, there's a list of countries to which it applies. The two you've mentioned aren't on it. You can look it up in the Amsterdam treaty if you'd like :) edit: here's the law for your convenience: https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/SK/TXT/?uri=CELEX:11997D/PRO/02 https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/SK/TXT/?uri=CELEX:11...
  - paganel 4y ago
    So an EU law that doesn’t apply to the whole EU, that bodes well for a confederate project.
    - malermeister 4y ago
      Isn't that what the article is arguing for though? A multi-speed Europe?
      - paganel 4y ago
        Count of disingenuous to argue for a multi-speed Europe starting from now on when we have been a multi-speed Europe already. I'd be perfectly fine with that, too, but getting rid of the unanimity thingie is just asking for trouble.

guerrilla 4y ago

> It was signed on 14 June 1985, near the town of Schengen, Luxembourg, by five of the ten member states of the then European Economic Community. > Originally, the Schengen treaties and the rules adopted under them operated independently from the European Union. However, in 1999 they were incorporated into European Union law by the Amsterdam Treaty, while providing opt-outs for the only two EU member states that had remained outside the Area: Ireland and the United Kingdom (which subsequently withdrew from the EU in 2020). Schengen is now a core part of EU law, and all EU member states without an opt-out which have not already joined the Schengen Area are legally obliged to do so when technical requirements have been met. Several non-EU countries are included in the area through special association agreements.

kmonsen 4y ago

You are right, and wrong. You cannot drive through Switzerland (I lived there for two years so have personal experience) without showing passport. It works some of the time, but they do checks. For me it has been perhaps 25% of the time entering Switzerland I was stopped and passport for everyone in the car was checked. This was on a Swiss registered car with Swiss highway sticker on.