4 ms·

I've already seen quite a lot

by zeofig 4y ago

vegai_ 4y ago
Yeah, the trailer wasn't extremely promising. But who knows -- I think it's entirely possible to mix contemporary trendy politics without hurting the quality of the actual piece. It's more a question of overall quality than the actual politics. The lack of original source material is probably a riskier problem, and could lead into a GoT -like mess.
- fallingknife 4y ago
  I think contemporary trendy politics is cancer so I'm kinda biased here. But even if I concede that you are right and you can mix that in without hurting the quality, I can say confidently that you can't do that with Tolkien. He was a deeply religious Catholic and his world view and "contemporary trendy politics" just don't mix.
- Agamus 4y ago
  Sorry, I'm confused. Does this new book incorporate 'trendy politics'? If someone knows, please tell. If it does not, this is one of the most exciting bits of news I have ever heard. If so, then the opposite is the case.
  - dwighttk 4y ago
    I think parent was writing about the Amazon series.
- causality0 4y ago
  It hasn't been done well lately. I nearly cringed out of my skin when Peacemaker and Resident Alien both made awkward anti-anti-masker speeches on the same week and I happened to watch them back to back.
- simonh 4y ago
  I'm trying to keep an open mind. I've no problem per se with Middle Earth including plenty of people of colour, it's right there in the source material. Numenor was quite far south, and the nearest places to it on the continent are Umbar and the far south. We know they had lots of contact and colonies there for thousands of years, and it would actually be kind of weird if there weren't southerners or people with some southern descent turning up in Numenor. Plenty of justification for people of colour to play a huge role in any story of or about Numenor, or any group that comes from there. I'm not sure about the Elves and Dwarves, but sure, if humans from the south are of colour, why not Elves and Dwarves from down south too? It all depends how it's handled. Game of Thrones did a fairly good job on this, with characters from different parts of the world often looking like it, aside from some issues with casting extras (pasty looking Irish Dothraki for example). As for warrior Galadriel, well, she was in a war. She personally walked all the way from the Undying Lands through the icy wastes of the North with her people, who suffered huge losses. That journey was no joke, and I have no problem believing she fought alongside them, and was entirely capable of doing so. Having said that the fake fan engagement stuff was horrifyingly cringey. We'll just have to see.
  - kaczordon 4y ago
    Apparently the producers are saying there will be female orcs too: https://www.ign.com/articles/rings-of-power-female-orcs https://www.ign.com/articles/rings-of-power-female-orcs It really seems like the show runners are focused on the story here. /s
    - vegai_ 4y ago
      Tolkien said in one letter that there are female orcs. That some would become warriors is perhaps a bit of a leap.
- ghaff 4y ago
  While I'm certainly not a GoT hater, trendy as that may be, I acknowledge that--for whatever reason--the storyline became weaker once it didn't have GRRM source to draw from. That said, there is no shortage of excellent films that were adapted from mediocre source material or diverged significantly from it. [ADDED: And, of course, no shortage of films based on original screenplays.]
  - CursedUrn 4y ago
    People don't hate GoT because it's trendy, they hate it because it went from something of high quality to something of low quality as the seasons progressed.
    - Fnoord 4y ago
      why either love or hate it? I love S1-5. Not sure about 6 or 7 but I disliked 8 for sure. Its not like S3 or S4 or S5 was bad. Then I'd have quit earlier already. I can still recommend S1-S5 at the very least.
  - anvuong 4y ago
    People hate GoT because how quick it went from 100 to 0. I doubt they put more than one day in writing the entire S8, that was a dumpster fire of writing.
- _gabe_ 4y ago
  > But who knows -- I think it's entirely possible to mix contemporary trendy politics without hurting the quality of the actual piece. I feel like The Boys Season 3 is a stark counterpoint to this opinion. I didn't mind the left leaning stuff in the first 2 seasons because it wasn't so overtly in your face, but season 3 just had to inject it in literally every aspect of the show. I've never literally had a bad taste in my mouth after watching a show, but I promptly cancelled my prime membership with a bad taste in my mouth after watching the first couple episodes of this season.
  - darthrupert 4y ago
    I'm not saying it would be probable, just that it is possible. For example, the first two Alien movies had strong female characters (perhaps a statement in 70s and 80s) that made the movie better.
  - timmytokyo 4y ago
    > I didn't mind the left leaning stuff in the first 2 seasons because it wasn't so overtly in your face. I don't get this. The villain of season 2 was literally a Nazi named "Stormfront" who riled up a cult-like following on social media. How much more in your face could it possibly get? Season 3 feels like a natural continuation of that. In fact, one could argue that the whole series is more cynical than political. Season 3 is poking a stick at ostensibly "woke" corporations with its portrayal of Vought as a shallow and opportunistic supporter of progressive causes.
    - 3qz 4y ago
      The problem is that the new season includes current events. I don’t care that the villain is a Nazi, but making a caricature of a present day political opponent and then beating them up on screen goes too far. I’m so sick of hearing about BLM.
    - _gabe_ 4y ago
      > The villain of season 2 was literally a Nazi named "Stormfront" who riled up a cult-like following on social media. Yes... and? I don't know you personally, but if you truly believe that the vast majority of conservatives are closet Nazis, may I suggest you actually talk to some real people? Not fringe people on Reddit or some other social media site, but real life people that are conservatives. Conservatives of whom you would be very hard pressed to find someone who does not denounce all forms of Naziism and communism in general?

I've already seen quite a lot

by zeofig 4y ago

I've already seen quite a lot

Yeah, the trailer wasn't extremely promising. But who knows -- I think it's entirely possible to mix contemporary trendy politics without hurting the quality of the actual piece. It's more a question of overall quality than the actual politics. The lack of original source material is probably a riskier problem, and could lead into a GoT -like mess.

fallingknife 4y ago
I think contemporary trendy politics is cancer so I'm kinda biased here. But even if I concede that you are right and you can mix that in without hurting the quality, I can say confidently that you can't do that with Tolkien. He was a deeply religious Catholic and his world view and "contemporary trendy politics" just don't mix.
Agamus 4y ago
Sorry, I'm confused. Does this new book incorporate 'trendy politics'? If someone knows, please tell. If it does not, this is one of the most exciting bits of news I have ever heard. If so, then the opposite is the case.
- dwighttk 4y ago
  I think parent was writing about the Amazon series.
causality0 4y ago
It hasn't been done well lately. I nearly cringed out of my skin when Peacemaker and Resident Alien both made awkward anti-anti-masker speeches on the same week and I happened to watch them back to back.
simonh 4y ago
I'm trying to keep an open mind. I've no problem per se with Middle Earth including plenty of people of colour, it's right there in the source material. Numenor was quite far south, and the nearest places to it on the continent are Umbar and the far south. We know they had lots of contact and colonies there for thousands of years, and it would actually be kind of weird if there weren't southerners or people with some southern descent turning up in Numenor. Plenty of justification for people of colour to play a huge role in any story of or about Numenor, or any group that comes from there. I'm not sure about the Elves and Dwarves, but sure, if humans from the south are of colour, why not Elves and Dwarves from down south too? It all depends how it's handled. Game of Thrones did a fairly good job on this, with characters from different parts of the world often looking like it, aside from some issues with casting extras (pasty looking Irish Dothraki for example). As for warrior Galadriel, well, she was in a war. She personally walked all the way from the Undying Lands through the icy wastes of the North with her people, who suffered huge losses. That journey was no joke, and I have no problem believing she fought alongside them, and was entirely capable of doing so. Having said that the fake fan engagement stuff was horrifyingly cringey. We'll just have to see.
- kaczordon 4y ago
  Apparently the producers are saying there will be female orcs too: https://www.ign.com/articles/rings-of-power-female-orcs https://www.ign.com/articles/rings-of-power-female-orcs It really seems like the show runners are focused on the story here. /s
  - vegai_ 4y ago
    Tolkien said in one letter that there are female orcs. That some would become warriors is perhaps a bit of a leap.
ghaff 4y ago
While I'm certainly not a GoT hater, trendy as that may be, I acknowledge that--for whatever reason--the storyline became weaker once it didn't have GRRM source to draw from. That said, there is no shortage of excellent films that were adapted from mediocre source material or diverged significantly from it. [ADDED: And, of course, no shortage of films based on original screenplays.]
- CursedUrn 4y ago
  People don't hate GoT because it's trendy, they hate it because it went from something of high quality to something of low quality as the seasons progressed.
  - Fnoord 4y ago
    why either love or hate it? I love S1-5. Not sure about 6 or 7 but I disliked 8 for sure. Its not like S3 or S4 or S5 was bad. Then I'd have quit earlier already. I can still recommend S1-S5 at the very least.
- anvuong 4y ago
  People hate GoT because how quick it went from 100 to 0. I doubt they put more than one day in writing the entire S8, that was a dumpster fire of writing.
_gabe_ 4y ago
> But who knows -- I think it's entirely possible to mix contemporary trendy politics without hurting the quality of the actual piece. I feel like The Boys Season 3 is a stark counterpoint to this opinion. I didn't mind the left leaning stuff in the first 2 seasons because it wasn't so overtly in your face, but season 3 just had to inject it in literally every aspect of the show. I've never literally had a bad taste in my mouth after watching a show, but I promptly cancelled my prime membership with a bad taste in my mouth after watching the first couple episodes of this season.
- darthrupert 4y ago
  I'm not saying it would be probable, just that it is possible. For example, the first two Alien movies had strong female characters (perhaps a statement in 70s and 80s) that made the movie better.
- timmytokyo 4y ago
  > I didn't mind the left leaning stuff in the first 2 seasons because it wasn't so overtly in your face. I don't get this. The villain of season 2 was literally a Nazi named "Stormfront" who riled up a cult-like following on social media. How much more in your face could it possibly get? Season 3 feels like a natural continuation of that. In fact, one could argue that the whole series is more cynical than political. Season 3 is poking a stick at ostensibly "woke" corporations with its portrayal of Vought as a shallow and opportunistic supporter of progressive causes.
  - 3qz 4y ago
    The problem is that the new season includes current events. I don’t care that the villain is a Nazi, but making a caricature of a present day political opponent and then beating them up on screen goes too far. I’m so sick of hearing about BLM.
  - _gabe_ 4y ago
    > The villain of season 2 was literally a Nazi named "Stormfront" who riled up a cult-like following on social media. Yes... and? I don't know you personally, but if you truly believe that the vast majority of conservatives are closet Nazis, may I suggest you actually talk to some real people? Not fringe people on Reddit or some other social media site, but real life people that are conservatives. Conservatives of whom you would be very hard pressed to find someone who does not denounce all forms of Naziism and communism in general?