4 ms·

Does he also mention why?

andyjohnson0 4y ago
Its to do with the Play Store requiring apps to target the Android 10 api level. Details at [1]. [1] https://www.xda-developers.com/termux-terminal-linux-google-play-updates-stopped/ https://www.xda-developers.com/termux-terminal-linux-google-...
- rektide 4y ago
  The "write-or-execute" policy causing this havoc is remarkably similar to what is being done with WebExtensions v3 banning any dynamic code execution. Termux wants to be able to bring down code & let users run it, but that's verboten. Similarly, all WebExtensions will be forbidden from bringing down code (or accepting user entered code). That sounds fine/good for like 98% of extensions. But the other 2%... extensions like GreaseMonkey/VioletMonkey/TamperMonkey, or one could imagine something like IFTTT or PushBullet, where the extension might perhaps want some intrinsic extensibility to itself: those are all now verboten. There's not really any discussion or push/pull on the new security regimes. Computers just get more and more clamped down. I'm interested to see how Termux goes forward. In the past they seemed to have some "in-APK packaging" notions for how to deal with Android 10+. I haven't stumbled upon a good description of what this is or how it would work, and I'm not really sure whether these ideas are still active or whether F-Droid and using ever aging SDKs is the way forward.
  - jeroenhd 4y ago
    Termux still works fine on any Android device, all you've got to do is install it through F-Droid or similar. Google Play is the party blocking W+X, Android itself will happily execute your downloaded binaries (for now, at least). There are also other APIs that are absolutely verboten by Google Play but will work fine if the app is installed through alternative app stores.
    - pjmlp 4y ago
      Nope, Android started to ban linking to native APIs that aren't officially part of the NDK, like Linux syscalls. More recent versions will just kill the application if they get used, and Termux folks refuse to accept that they have to go through JNI for specific OS features, so they won't be around for much longer, other than on rooted devices. Or they might eventually accept how things are done on Android.
      - danhor 4y ago
        Since termux just uses regular unix applications, adapting them to use JNI sounds like a world of pain.
        pjmlp 4y ago
        That is what they refuse to accept, Android isn't UNIX, it just happens to use Linux kernel. The official APIs are Java based, ISO C and ISO C++ standard libraries, and the NDK libraries that ship on device.
        nyanpasu64 4y ago
        Google is killing Android as a general-purpose computing platform.
        pjmlp 4y ago
        Phones were never a general-purpose computing platform to start with.
        yjftsjthsd-h 4y ago
        That's begging the question; the only reason phones aren't general-purpose computers is because Google and Apple tend to block out anything that would let the user actually use the computer as more than a toy.
  - Gigachad 4y ago
    I think this is not the worst situation. Downloading executable code is very rare in normal use cases and is extremely common and powerful for malware. For the common user, its better to just turn this off. And for the power user, they are free to sideload apps that can do whatever they want.
    - R0b0t1 4y ago
      The problem is you can't actually turn it off like you think you should be able to do. As well, you should expect feature parity (automated updates and so on) with the R^X turned off.
syrrim 4y ago
The play store version isn't being updated, owing to a policy change by google affecting their package manager
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]

Its to do with the Play Store requiring apps to target the Android 10 api level. Details at [1]. [1] https://www.xda-developers.com/termux-terminal-linux-google-play-updates-stopped/ https://www.xda-developers.com/termux-terminal-linux-google-...

rektide 4y ago
The "write-or-execute" policy causing this havoc is remarkably similar to what is being done with WebExtensions v3 banning any dynamic code execution. Termux wants to be able to bring down code & let users run it, but that's verboten. Similarly, all WebExtensions will be forbidden from bringing down code (or accepting user entered code). That sounds fine/good for like 98% of extensions. But the other 2%... extensions like GreaseMonkey/VioletMonkey/TamperMonkey, or one could imagine something like IFTTT or PushBullet, where the extension might perhaps want some intrinsic extensibility to itself: those are all now verboten. There's not really any discussion or push/pull on the new security regimes. Computers just get more and more clamped down. I'm interested to see how Termux goes forward. In the past they seemed to have some "in-APK packaging" notions for how to deal with Android 10+. I haven't stumbled upon a good description of what this is or how it would work, and I'm not really sure whether these ideas are still active or whether F-Droid and using ever aging SDKs is the way forward.
- jeroenhd 4y ago
  Termux still works fine on any Android device, all you've got to do is install it through F-Droid or similar. Google Play is the party blocking W+X, Android itself will happily execute your downloaded binaries (for now, at least). There are also other APIs that are absolutely verboten by Google Play but will work fine if the app is installed through alternative app stores.
  - pjmlp 4y ago
    Nope, Android started to ban linking to native APIs that aren't officially part of the NDK, like Linux syscalls. More recent versions will just kill the application if they get used, and Termux folks refuse to accept that they have to go through JNI for specific OS features, so they won't be around for much longer, other than on rooted devices. Or they might eventually accept how things are done on Android.
    - danhor 4y ago
      Since termux just uses regular unix applications, adapting them to use JNI sounds like a world of pain.
      - pjmlp 4y ago
        That is what they refuse to accept, Android isn't UNIX, it just happens to use Linux kernel. The official APIs are Java based, ISO C and ISO C++ standard libraries, and the NDK libraries that ship on device.
        nyanpasu64 4y ago
        Google is killing Android as a general-purpose computing platform.
        pjmlp 4y ago
        Phones were never a general-purpose computing platform to start with.
        yjftsjthsd-h 4y ago
        That's begging the question; the only reason phones aren't general-purpose computers is because Google and Apple tend to block out anything that would let the user actually use the computer as more than a toy.
- Gigachad 4y ago
  I think this is not the worst situation. Downloading executable code is very rare in normal use cases and is extremely common and powerful for malware. For the common user, its better to just turn this off. And for the power user, they are free to sideload apps that can do whatever they want.
  - R0b0t1 4y ago
    The problem is you can't actually turn it off like you think you should be able to do. As well, you should expect feature parity (automated updates and so on) with the R^X turned off.

syrrim 4y ago

The play store version isn't being updated, owing to a policy change by google affecting their package manager

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]