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And how many times did oracle java have regressions for timezone changes? I hate them for my 2am(1am?) emergency daylight savings calls. Oracle java flourishe

by b112 4y ago

And how many times did oracle java have regressions for timezone changes? I hate them for my 2am(1am?) emergency daylight savings calls. Oracle java flourished, but part of that has been suing everyone under the sun for using it. Look at android/google... More scam, more or the same from oracle.

cogman10 4y ago
> And how many times did oracle java have regressions for timezone changes? Did other languages handle it better? Is this a Java problem or is this a "Governments changing timezone information all the time is hard" problem? > Oracle java flourished, but part of that has been suing everyone under the sun for using it. > Look at android/google... AFAIK, android/google is the ONLY ones they've sued. Do you have other examples?
- rascul 4y ago
  It was before Oracle, but I'm reminded of Sun's lawsuit against Microsoft over their Java implementation. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Visual_J%2B%2B#Sun's_litigation_against_Microsoft https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Visual_J%2B%2B#Sun's_litigatio...
  - cogman10 4y ago
    Right, which is why I think it's a little crazy to talk about how litigious oracle is with Java when there's no major cases I can think of besides the google and microsoft cases. It's been over 10 years, you'd think there'd be far more examples of bad behavior.
- cesarb 4y ago
  > Did other languages handle it better? Is this a Java problem or is this a "Governments changing timezone information all the time is hard" problem? Java is peculiarly annoying in that it doesn't use the normal tzdata database, it has its own copy of the database, with its own separate updating procedure. Even when it's the openjdk package on a Linux distribution, you often have a "tzdata" package (used by everything else) and a "tzdata-java" package (used exclusively for the JVM).
  - adra 4y ago
    So yeah, cross platform is hard and this was their implementation of it? How do other languages handle this cross platform use case? I'm just being pragmatic here and less dogmatic. They chose to manage their own tz records so that the host is could be broken to high hell and theirs would still work. My assumption of this is having to support N different is and arch differences that made this non-trivial when they adopted it. Maybe now there are easier paths to take, so I suppose patches welcome?
    - voidfunc 4y ago
      Its one of those things where a switch to use the host tz database would be welcome
    - Asooka 4y ago
      Everything else uses the system timezone database wrapping whatever api the os provides.

by b112 4y ago

cogman10 4y ago

> And how many times did oracle java have regressions for timezone changes? Did other languages handle it better? Is this a Java problem or is this a "Governments changing timezone information all the time is hard" problem? > Oracle java flourished, but part of that has been suing everyone under the sun for using it. > Look at android/google... AFAIK, android/google is the ONLY ones they've sued. Do you have other examples?

rascul 4y ago
It was before Oracle, but I'm reminded of Sun's lawsuit against Microsoft over their Java implementation. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Visual_J%2B%2B#Sun's_litigation_against_Microsoft https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Visual_J%2B%2B#Sun's_litigatio...
- cogman10 4y ago
  Right, which is why I think it's a little crazy to talk about how litigious oracle is with Java when there's no major cases I can think of besides the google and microsoft cases. It's been over 10 years, you'd think there'd be far more examples of bad behavior.
cesarb 4y ago
> Did other languages handle it better? Is this a Java problem or is this a "Governments changing timezone information all the time is hard" problem? Java is peculiarly annoying in that it doesn't use the normal tzdata database, it has its own copy of the database, with its own separate updating procedure. Even when it's the openjdk package on a Linux distribution, you often have a "tzdata" package (used by everything else) and a "tzdata-java" package (used exclusively for the JVM).
- adra 4y ago
  So yeah, cross platform is hard and this was their implementation of it? How do other languages handle this cross platform use case? I'm just being pragmatic here and less dogmatic. They chose to manage their own tz records so that the host is could be broken to high hell and theirs would still work. My assumption of this is having to support N different is and arch differences that made this non-trivial when they adopted it. Maybe now there are easier paths to take, so I suppose patches welcome?
  - voidfunc 4y ago
    Its one of those things where a switch to use the host tz database would be welcome
  - Asooka 4y ago
    Everything else uses the system timezone database wrapping whatever api the os provides.