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>natural gas reserves are limited People have been claiming peak oil since the 1930's. Yawn. > So green energy has supported economic and social development

by EricE 4y ago

>natural gas reserves are limited People have been claiming peak oil since the 1930's. Yawn. > So green energy has supported economic and social development through electrification without adding new pollution sources. Except for the manufacture and disposal of these "green" sources. > Pursuing nuclear is great but solar/wind are much cheaper. Solar and wind are cheaper? Ha! We already have problems recycling blades from wind turbines and most are still not at the end of their lifespan. Same for solar - what do you do with all this crap a the end of it's 20 year lifespan? *Total* cost of ownership. And never mind solar and wind still suck for base load management since we still lack cost effective energy storage that can scale at the grid level.

rcMgD2BwE72F 4y ago
>People have been claiming peak oil since the 1930's. Yawn. Are you claiming fossil fuels aren't limited? Also, oil peak is widely believed to have been reached already https://www.carbonbrief.org/analysis-world-has-already-passed-peak-oil-bp-figures-reveal/ https://www.carbonbrief.org/analysis-world-has-already-passe... If the cost of extraction rises due to oil and gas being more and more difficult to access (because it's limited, obviously), you could claim demand has peaked but it would still be due to production cost (i.e production peaking). "The Stone Age didn't end for lack of stone, and the oil age will end long before the world runs out of oil" (Ahmed Zaki Yamani, former SA Minister of Oil) > We already have problems recycling blades from wind turbines and most are still not at the end of their lifespan. Of course we have a problem recycling things when there are to few of these things to justify setting up an industry. It isn't because we can't recycle them: https://eu.usatoday.com/story/news/factcheck/2021/11/30/fact-check-recycling-can-keep-wind-turbine-blades-out-landfills/8647981002/ https://eu.usatoday.com/story/news/factcheck/2021/11/30/fact... >what do you do with all this crap a the end of it's 20 year lifespan? They now last 25+ years: https://news.energysage.com/how-long-do-solar-panels-last/ https://news.energysage.com/how-long-do-solar-panels-last/ and that's based on data from 2012. > And never mind solar and wind still suck for base load management since we still lack cost effective energy storage that can scale at the grid level. Then why does RTE (French national transmission system operator) have plans to switch to 100% renewables by 2050? https://www.rte-france.com/analyses-tendances-et-prospectives/bilan-previsionnel-2050-futurs-energetiques https://www.rte-france.com/analyses-tendances-et-prospective...
- treeman79 4y ago
  There have been articles for many decades now that we are reaching the peak of what can be pulled out of the ground. That we will simply run out of oil. This is a lie. There is plenty of supply. This is the argument op is making. Whether to burn it or not is a different question.
  - rcMgD2BwE72F 4y ago
    >This is a lie. There is plenty of supply. That is and never has been the crux of the matter. We need affordable supply. If I have 10 apples to sell, 9 of them priced at $1, and the last one at $100 billion, I could also claim to have plenty of supply.
  - helmholtz 4y ago
    "Plenty of supply" and "peak oil" are not mutually exclusive
  - rcMgD2BwE72F 4y ago
    It's also interesting to know that Russia could not maintain its production of oil at last year's market price, due to the lack of investment (it had simply become unprofitable). https://ogst.ifpenergiesnouvelles.fr/articles/ogst/full_html/2019/01/ogst190118/ogst190118.html https://ogst.ifpenergiesnouvelles.fr/articles/ogst/full_html... The war may force Russia to sell their oil to non-Western countries but the crisis helped support oil price and made global investments in O&G profitable for them again (and for every other producers too). Just like with the war in Iraq - which explains why Putin did not oppose the US invasion for long after they realized it would bring enormous profits to Russia.
colechristensen 4y ago
The peak oil producing month so far is November 2018. With COVID-19, and now war in Ukraine and an impending global recession combined with the progress of electric vehicles and solar production, it is entirely possible that this record will stand.

by EricE 4y ago

rcMgD2BwE72F 4y ago

>People have been claiming peak oil since the 1930's. Yawn. Are you claiming fossil fuels aren't limited? Also, oil peak is widely believed to have been reached already https://www.carbonbrief.org/analysis-world-has-already-passed-peak-oil-bp-figures-reveal/ https://www.carbonbrief.org/analysis-world-has-already-passe... If the cost of extraction rises due to oil and gas being more and more difficult to access (because it's limited, obviously), you could claim demand has peaked but it would still be due to production cost (i.e production peaking). "The Stone Age didn't end for lack of stone, and the oil age will end long before the world runs out of oil" (Ahmed Zaki Yamani, former SA Minister of Oil) > We already have problems recycling blades from wind turbines and most are still not at the end of their lifespan. Of course we have a problem recycling things when there are to few of these things to justify setting up an industry. It isn't because we can't recycle them: https://eu.usatoday.com/story/news/factcheck/2021/11/30/fact-check-recycling-can-keep-wind-turbine-blades-out-landfills/8647981002/ https://eu.usatoday.com/story/news/factcheck/2021/11/30/fact... >what do you do with all this crap a the end of it's 20 year lifespan? They now last 25+ years: https://news.energysage.com/how-long-do-solar-panels-last/ https://news.energysage.com/how-long-do-solar-panels-last/ and that's based on data from 2012. > And never mind solar and wind still suck for base load management since we still lack cost effective energy storage that can scale at the grid level. Then why does RTE (French national transmission system operator) have plans to switch to 100% renewables by 2050? https://www.rte-france.com/analyses-tendances-et-prospectives/bilan-previsionnel-2050-futurs-energetiques https://www.rte-france.com/analyses-tendances-et-prospective...

treeman79 4y ago
There have been articles for many decades now that we are reaching the peak of what can be pulled out of the ground. That we will simply run out of oil. This is a lie. There is plenty of supply. This is the argument op is making. Whether to burn it or not is a different question.
- rcMgD2BwE72F 4y ago
  >This is a lie. There is plenty of supply. That is and never has been the crux of the matter. We need affordable supply. If I have 10 apples to sell, 9 of them priced at $1, and the last one at $100 billion, I could also claim to have plenty of supply.
- helmholtz 4y ago
  "Plenty of supply" and "peak oil" are not mutually exclusive
- rcMgD2BwE72F 4y ago
  It's also interesting to know that Russia could not maintain its production of oil at last year's market price, due to the lack of investment (it had simply become unprofitable). https://ogst.ifpenergiesnouvelles.fr/articles/ogst/full_html/2019/01/ogst190118/ogst190118.html https://ogst.ifpenergiesnouvelles.fr/articles/ogst/full_html... The war may force Russia to sell their oil to non-Western countries but the crisis helped support oil price and made global investments in O&G profitable for them again (and for every other producers too). Just like with the war in Iraq - which explains why Putin did not oppose the US invasion for long after they realized it would bring enormous profits to Russia.

colechristensen 4y ago

The peak oil producing month so far is November 2018. With COVID-19, and now war in Ukraine and an impending global recession combined with the progress of electric vehicles and solar production, it is entirely possible that this record will stand.