4 ms·

Sure there is, run your own network, servers and channels, have better content and attract users. You can have as many #chat channels as you want, and run them

Sure there is, run your own network, servers and channels, have better content and attract users. You can have as many #chat channels as you want, and run them as you see fit. Anyone can run an irc server, and it does not have to appeal or cater to everyone.

dTal 4y ago
i.e. "move to Canada". That is not helpful. Even if I did set up an alternative network, it would have the same issue - a broken social model, enforced at the technical level. That's assuming I could persuade a critical mass of people to use the new network. "Have better content"? An IRC network has no "content", it has users. Talking to other users is the point. How many IRC networks are there?
- mmmmklllljgd 4y ago
  Every website has the social model you just described. You'll have to start with a decentralized protocol without server admins (the true monarchs) to get around what you're describing. This website has dang. Slack has channel owners. Reddit has mods and admins. 4chan has janitors and admins. Flat forums had mods IRC is the same as everything else. It's a fine thing to point out, it's just not unique to IRC in any way
  - rektide 4y ago
    > You'll have to start with a decentralized protocol without server admins This is all or nothing thinking. We could design centralized protocols that have, for example, voting. We could design centralized protocols that call together digital juries[1]. Yes there may be powerhungry mods at the very top. They might be able to throw the votes or what not. Abuse is possible on centralized systems. But there's so vastly much we could be trying, could be doing, to alter the gerontocratic imbalance of power, even on centralized systems. [1] http://digitaljuries.com/ http://digitaljuries.com/
    - antris 4y ago
      Nothing's stopping you to use IRC this way, and it's trivial to add a bot to your channel with a poll feature. The problem isn't that nobody has designed or created such a system: it's that they're not very popular.
      - rektide 4y ago
        > The problem isn't that nobody has designed or created such a system: it's that they're not very popular. This assertion would be more interesting if there were more visible attempts. I haven't found anything on github I can deploy to moderate a channel via any kind of public-governance or other models. Can you? Personally, I think we've done very little experimentation, and the gerontocratic rulers we dwell under generally would prefer staying in tight control. You talk about popularity, but popular for who? Even if some kind of democratic governance gained mass popularity, how many mods would be willing to hand over their long held control over channels/sites?

dTal 4y ago

i.e. "move to Canada". That is not helpful. Even if I did set up an alternative network, it would have the same issue - a broken social model, enforced at the technical level. That's assuming I could persuade a critical mass of people to use the new network. "Have better content"? An IRC network has no "content", it has users. Talking to other users is the point. How many IRC networks are there?

mmmmklllljgd 4y ago
Every website has the social model you just described. You'll have to start with a decentralized protocol without server admins (the true monarchs) to get around what you're describing. This website has dang. Slack has channel owners. Reddit has mods and admins. 4chan has janitors and admins. Flat forums had mods IRC is the same as everything else. It's a fine thing to point out, it's just not unique to IRC in any way
- rektide 4y ago
  > You'll have to start with a decentralized protocol without server admins This is all or nothing thinking. We could design centralized protocols that have, for example, voting. We could design centralized protocols that call together digital juries[1]. Yes there may be powerhungry mods at the very top. They might be able to throw the votes or what not. Abuse is possible on centralized systems. But there's so vastly much we could be trying, could be doing, to alter the gerontocratic imbalance of power, even on centralized systems. [1] http://digitaljuries.com/ http://digitaljuries.com/
  - antris 4y ago
    Nothing's stopping you to use IRC this way, and it's trivial to add a bot to your channel with a poll feature. The problem isn't that nobody has designed or created such a system: it's that they're not very popular.
    - rektide 4y ago
      > The problem isn't that nobody has designed or created such a system: it's that they're not very popular. This assertion would be more interesting if there were more visible attempts. I haven't found anything on github I can deploy to moderate a channel via any kind of public-governance or other models. Can you? Personally, I think we've done very little experimentation, and the gerontocratic rulers we dwell under generally would prefer staying in tight control. You talk about popularity, but popular for who? Even if some kind of democratic governance gained mass popularity, how many mods would be willing to hand over their long held control over channels/sites?