4 ms·

75k a year of college is affordable for a household income of 150k? Really?

by kaesar14 4y ago

rayiner 4y ago
If you’re family is making $150k/year then your kids don’t need the leg up from going to an Ivy League school.
- kaesar14 4y ago
  Really? So the only people who should be able to go to Ivy League schools are those poor enough to get aid and those rich enough to pay for the entire fee? We shouldn't be evaluating our youth on their merit? What kind of solution is that? Great way to make sure that the children of the professional class of people who make that sort of money (lawyers, engineers, nurses) not work as hard as possible and use their upbringing to contribute to the future of the country. Putrid take.
  - rayiner 4y ago
    > Really? So the only people who should be able to go to Ivy League schools are those poor enough to get aid and those rich enough to pay for the entire fee? Giving poor kids a leg up over upper middle class kids is a win regardless of what you do with rich kids. That’s a separate issue. > Great way to make sure that the children of the professional class of people who make that sort of money (lawyers, engineers, nurses) not work as hard as possible and use their upbringing to contribute to the future of the country. The upper middle class has been instrumental in the last few decades in driving inequality. Behind every factory that’s shut down in Milwaukee and outsourced to China there’s lawyers and consultants and even logistical engineers making that happen. See: https://www.theguardian.com/inequality/2017/jul/15/how-us-middle-classes-hoard-opportunity-privilege https://www.theguardian.com/inequality/2017/jul/15/how-us-mi...
    - tuckerman 4y ago
      So we should be punishing children of consultants to make them atone for the hereditary sins of writing reports/collecting information so some executive somewhere can actually make the call?
    - kaesar14 4y ago
      Why would you do that through financial aid? If a kid's worked hard enough to get into school they should be allowed to go regardless of their financial status, 75k a year is not affordable at all to a household making 150k a year. After taxes that's nearly all of that home's take home pay. You can give poor kids a leg up with consideration to their backgrounds during admissions time - make it harder for more privileged kids to get into school in the first place, I'm all for it. I don't see how that's a separate issue at all. Your second point doesn't make any sense - we should be punishing children because of the amorphous negative externalities of every professional in the United States economy? They're to blame as opposed to the leadership of modern corporations that vote themselves multi million dollar bonuses each year while offshoring business and keeping worker pay down?
      - rayiner 4y ago
        We’re not talking about “punishing” individual kids. We are talking about the policies adopted by non-profit colleges with respect to use of their endowments. I don’t see any problem with basing that decision on the desire to reduce income inequality—inequality that’s being driven in large part by armies of upper middle class people who have been pulling away from the middle class over 30 years just as even richer people have. What’s wrong with universities structuring their financial aid policies with that in mind?
      - xyzzyz 4y ago
        > 75k a year is not affordable at all to a household making 150k a year. After taxes that's nearly all of that home's take home pay. Hopefully, American making $150k/year heard about savings, and can also predict the expense of college, and can plan for it in advance.
        prepend 4y ago
        This is such horseshit. First, the $150k is at the time of child’s application, not over their entire life. Second, college tuition has been increasing at highly variable rates so I doubt anyone would have guessed that tuition would increase 8%/year for 18 years. Third, four years of Dartmouth tuition is $300k. Let’s graciously say the average income over the kid’s 18 years is $100k. That means that that parents would need to save $16k/year or 16%. There’s no tax deferred program that allows $16k/year so factor in tax dollars. Fourth, families frequently have multiple children. So if they have two, you think parents should save 30% of their income for college? Or if 3, 45%? It’s funny how people imagine $150k is some massive amount of money. And it’s a decent living, but it’s not something that paying an extra $6k per month is possible.
tptacek 4y ago
What college costs $75k/year? My kids go to the flagship state school in Illinois (Champaign), their tuition is less than 1/4 of that, and we pay full freight.
- prepend 4y ago
  Dartmouth. The one this article is about. And many more.
  - tptacek 4y ago
    So, respectfully, and I'm sorry for the emotive language, but don't fucking go to Dartmouth. The existence of the Bugatti Veyron does not means cars in general are a 7 figure purchase.
    - kaesar14 4y ago
      Our parents generation were able to go to colleges like Dartmouth at an affordable rate. Now we are not. There's clearly a problem that needs solving.
      - tptacek 4y ago
        No, it isn't. Dartmouth is a luxury good. It's undeserving of any public policy consideration. If my parents found it easier to buy a yacht than I do, I wouldn't consider public policy interventions to "correct" the situation; I'd write my parents yacht off as a blip, and move forward.

75k a year of college is affordable for a household income of 150k? Really?

rayiner 4y ago

If you’re family is making $150k/year then your kids don’t need the leg up from going to an Ivy League school.

kaesar14 4y ago
Really? So the only people who should be able to go to Ivy League schools are those poor enough to get aid and those rich enough to pay for the entire fee? We shouldn't be evaluating our youth on their merit? What kind of solution is that? Great way to make sure that the children of the professional class of people who make that sort of money (lawyers, engineers, nurses) not work as hard as possible and use their upbringing to contribute to the future of the country. Putrid take.
- rayiner 4y ago
  > Really? So the only people who should be able to go to Ivy League schools are those poor enough to get aid and those rich enough to pay for the entire fee? Giving poor kids a leg up over upper middle class kids is a win regardless of what you do with rich kids. That’s a separate issue. > Great way to make sure that the children of the professional class of people who make that sort of money (lawyers, engineers, nurses) not work as hard as possible and use their upbringing to contribute to the future of the country. The upper middle class has been instrumental in the last few decades in driving inequality. Behind every factory that’s shut down in Milwaukee and outsourced to China there’s lawyers and consultants and even logistical engineers making that happen. See: https://www.theguardian.com/inequality/2017/jul/15/how-us-middle-classes-hoard-opportunity-privilege https://www.theguardian.com/inequality/2017/jul/15/how-us-mi...
  - tuckerman 4y ago
    So we should be punishing children of consultants to make them atone for the hereditary sins of writing reports/collecting information so some executive somewhere can actually make the call?
  - kaesar14 4y ago
    Why would you do that through financial aid? If a kid's worked hard enough to get into school they should be allowed to go regardless of their financial status, 75k a year is not affordable at all to a household making 150k a year. After taxes that's nearly all of that home's take home pay. You can give poor kids a leg up with consideration to their backgrounds during admissions time - make it harder for more privileged kids to get into school in the first place, I'm all for it. I don't see how that's a separate issue at all. Your second point doesn't make any sense - we should be punishing children because of the amorphous negative externalities of every professional in the United States economy? They're to blame as opposed to the leadership of modern corporations that vote themselves multi million dollar bonuses each year while offshoring business and keeping worker pay down?
    - rayiner 4y ago
      We’re not talking about “punishing” individual kids. We are talking about the policies adopted by non-profit colleges with respect to use of their endowments. I don’t see any problem with basing that decision on the desire to reduce income inequality—inequality that’s being driven in large part by armies of upper middle class people who have been pulling away from the middle class over 30 years just as even richer people have. What’s wrong with universities structuring their financial aid policies with that in mind?
    - xyzzyz 4y ago
      > 75k a year is not affordable at all to a household making 150k a year. After taxes that's nearly all of that home's take home pay. Hopefully, American making $150k/year heard about savings, and can also predict the expense of college, and can plan for it in advance.
      - prepend 4y ago
        This is such horseshit. First, the $150k is at the time of child’s application, not over their entire life. Second, college tuition has been increasing at highly variable rates so I doubt anyone would have guessed that tuition would increase 8%/year for 18 years. Third, four years of Dartmouth tuition is $300k. Let’s graciously say the average income over the kid’s 18 years is $100k. That means that that parents would need to save $16k/year or 16%. There’s no tax deferred program that allows $16k/year so factor in tax dollars. Fourth, families frequently have multiple children. So if they have two, you think parents should save 30% of their income for college? Or if 3, 45%? It’s funny how people imagine $150k is some massive amount of money. And it’s a decent living, but it’s not something that paying an extra $6k per month is possible.

tptacek 4y ago

What college costs $75k/year? My kids go to the flagship state school in Illinois (Champaign), their tuition is less than 1/4 of that, and we pay full freight.

prepend 4y ago
Dartmouth. The one this article is about. And many more.
- tptacek 4y ago
  So, respectfully, and I'm sorry for the emotive language, but don't fucking go to Dartmouth. The existence of the Bugatti Veyron does not means cars in general are a 7 figure purchase.
  - kaesar14 4y ago
    Our parents generation were able to go to colleges like Dartmouth at an affordable rate. Now we are not. There's clearly a problem that needs solving.
    - tptacek 4y ago
      No, it isn't. Dartmouth is a luxury good. It's undeserving of any public policy consideration. If my parents found it easier to buy a yacht than I do, I wouldn't consider public policy interventions to "correct" the situation; I'd write my parents yacht off as a blip, and move forward.