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When's the last time a dual-UI delivered a good experience? Microsoft's been down this road a few times and it hasn't worked yet. Just look at Tablet XP. How

by roc 15y ago

When's the last time a dual-UI delivered a good experience? Microsoft's been down this road a few times and it hasn't worked yet. Just look at Tablet XP. How many great tablet apps are there? Ones that really leverage the stylus or were written to run efficiently and intelligently to start quickly, resume sessions, auto-save documents and preserve precious battery life? And how many were lazy ports with, maybe, enlarged controls and piles of inefficient legacy code lurking within? Code that just didn't map well to actual mobile use, where every second of delay feels like an age, and add up very quickly to a complete waste of time (compared to just walking over to a desktop). The only way I can see Windows 8's metro interface really working, is if the mode shift to classic Windows UI and apps is tied to a 'docking' situation. So, metro on the go, classic windows when you dock it into a proper display, keyboard, mouse and external power. That would give developers the right incentive to ensure they have something that works great while the user is out and about, designed specifically for that use case, while still keeping the full flexibility of legacy apps when the necessary peripherals (and plenty of electricity) are available.

bradleyland 15y ago
"When's the last time a dual-UI delivered a good experience?" Nothing works, until it does. I've had this same conversation with clients and partners alike. When something goes wrong, they reaction is often "Well it worked yesterday." Yes, everything works until it doesn't, and nothing works until it does. Evaluative statements of the past don't always predict the future. I agree that it won't be easy. That's why I say that there is no easy play here. Apple has forged ahead with a tablet that completely abandons past models. It is a 100% touch experience. It is undeniable that people have cried out for a dual-UI product though. Balance. I'm not saying consumers know best either. I'm saying that if Microsoft can balance the two, it could pay off. As far as developer incentives go, I think Apple has done Microsoft a huge favor. There will be a lot of bad dual-UI apps. Lazy programmers produce crappy applications. But there are a large number of motivated developers out there as well. They've seen what a touch UI should look like. The incentive comes in the form of inspiration and the validation (from consumers) that a 100% touch UI sells, and it sells well.
untog 15y ago
When's the last time a dual-UI delivered a good experience? Before the iPad was launched you could just as easily say "When's the last time a tablet delivered a good experience?". Microsoft and others had tried the form factor and failed, but then Apple came along and made a brilliant device. There is no reason the same could not happen for dual-UI devices.
- rimantas 15y ago
  That's kind of strange reasoning. iPad was the first tablet to deliver good experience, and this was exactly because UI was tailored for touch. This does little to assure that dual UI can be successful.
revjx 15y ago
The Nintendo DS / 3DS? A large amount of the software available for those consoles utilises a dual-screen interface in an interesting / useful way. Admittedly not a device designed for creation (beyond the camera and associated silly visual effects), but the original DS came out of nowhere and proved a dual-screen device with a stylus interface could work properly.
- sedev 15y ago
  That, unlike the iPad, Courier, and the future Win8 devices, is legitimately a specialty device, and if you think that Apple's restrictive about what software developers can do, take a look at Nintendo's policies. Then try browsing Hacker News, Gmail, or some PG essays on your DS. The DS is an interesting device and I love it to pieces, but comparing it to an iPad, a Win8 device, or a Courier tablet, is very, very tenuous.
zmonkeyz 15y ago
I'm pretty sure that's how the UI is going to work. For those with ARM tablets it will probably be a 24x7 Metro UI.

by roc 15y ago

bradleyland 15y ago

"When's the last time a dual-UI delivered a good experience?" Nothing works, until it does. I've had this same conversation with clients and partners alike. When something goes wrong, they reaction is often "Well it worked yesterday." Yes, everything works until it doesn't, and nothing works until it does. Evaluative statements of the past don't always predict the future. I agree that it won't be easy. That's why I say that there is no easy play here. Apple has forged ahead with a tablet that completely abandons past models. It is a 100% touch experience. It is undeniable that people have cried out for a dual-UI product though. Balance. I'm not saying consumers know best either. I'm saying that if Microsoft can balance the two, it could pay off. As far as developer incentives go, I think Apple has done Microsoft a huge favor. There will be a lot of bad dual-UI apps. Lazy programmers produce crappy applications. But there are a large number of motivated developers out there as well. They've seen what a touch UI should look like. The incentive comes in the form of inspiration and the validation (from consumers) that a 100% touch UI sells, and it sells well.

untog 15y ago

When's the last time a dual-UI delivered a good experience? Before the iPad was launched you could just as easily say "When's the last time a tablet delivered a good experience?". Microsoft and others had tried the form factor and failed, but then Apple came along and made a brilliant device. There is no reason the same could not happen for dual-UI devices.

rimantas 15y ago
That's kind of strange reasoning. iPad was the first tablet to deliver good experience, and this was exactly because UI was tailored for touch. This does little to assure that dual UI can be successful.

revjx 15y ago

The Nintendo DS / 3DS? A large amount of the software available for those consoles utilises a dual-screen interface in an interesting / useful way. Admittedly not a device designed for creation (beyond the camera and associated silly visual effects), but the original DS came out of nowhere and proved a dual-screen device with a stylus interface could work properly.

sedev 15y ago
That, unlike the iPad, Courier, and the future Win8 devices, is legitimately a specialty device, and if you think that Apple's restrictive about what software developers can do, take a look at Nintendo's policies. Then try browsing Hacker News, Gmail, or some PG essays on your DS. The DS is an interesting device and I love it to pieces, but comparing it to an iPad, a Win8 device, or a Courier tablet, is very, very tenuous.

zmonkeyz 15y ago

I'm pretty sure that's how the UI is going to work. For those with ARM tablets it will probably be a 24x7 Metro UI.