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Climate change is the ultimate scapegoat for everything! It’s a politicians’ dream, something nobody can solve but everyone can blame

javajosh 4y ago
Yeah, I've been following some climate folk on twitter. All they do is make dire warnings and ask for money. Personally, I know climate change is very real and quite dire, but so much "climate activism" seems to only exist to exist, and not to solve anything. I mean, all I want to see is a threat model and a list of realistic policies. But all I get is, "The earth is burning, and they don't care, so DONATE NOW!" Pathetic, and disheartening.
- smt88 4y ago
  > so much "climate activism" seems to only exist to exist, and not to solve anything. I mean, all I want to see is a threat model and a list of realistic policies. The problem is Twitter, not the activists. Real organizations and professionals in the industry write the kinds of analysis you're asking for all the time. You literally only need to Google something climate-change related and it's all you will see. They include realistic scenarios with sensitivity analyses, and they enormous troves of data that you can download yourself if you want to see where it came from. The problem isn't that this information is missing, it's that you're looking in the wrong place (and seemingly spending not even 10 seconds of effort to find it). Here are the first five Google results for "climate change scenario": - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Climate_change_scenario https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Climate_change_scenario (includes citations for further reading) - https://climatescenarios.org/primer/ https://climatescenarios.org/primer/ (explains what they are, includes citations, and overlays multiple climate models onto the same graph so you can see the differences) - https://www.nationalgeographic.com/environment/article/5-possible-climate-futures-from-the-optimistic-to-the-strange https://www.nationalgeographic.com/environment/article/5-pos... (summarizes the IPCC report, which is exactly what you're describing) - https://www.ipcc.ch/site/assets/uploads/2018/03/sres-en.pdf https://www.ipcc.ch/site/assets/uploads/2018/03/sres-en.pdf (an actual ICC report
- newsclues 4y ago
  When did the switch from activism to grifters occur?
  - hnusersarelame 4y ago
  - Lammy 4y ago
    IMO a “switch” from one to the other is the wrong way to look at it. There are plenty of people who legitimately care about the environment for the environment’s sake, like myself and probably anybody else on this website. What you should be looking for are the secondary and tertiary effects of climate legislation with a mind toward ideologies besides your own which would benefit from those effects. As always, correlation is not causation, but check out the inflection point for environmental interest among “American English” publications at the time of the first civil rights act in 1964: https://i.imgur.com/kP8ugvH.png https://i.imgur.com/kP8ugvH.png Since we’ve been picking on California in this thread this is also a good time to remember 1964 as the year California passed a state ballot proposition with the explicit intent of nullifying a state-level fair housing act passed one year earlier in 1963: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1964_California_Proposition_14 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1964_California_Proposition_14 Obviously California is a huge state with a huge number of conflicting ideologies, but I think it’s important to be mindful of ways one’s good intentions may be misdirected and misused.
- yababa_y 4y ago
  Like Project Drawdown? https://drawdown.org/ https://drawdown.org/
  - javajosh 4y ago
    Really like that website, thanks! It's hard to find sober, practical content on climate change (with the exception of the IPCC itself).
- jzellis 4y ago
  That's just the usual NGO and charity crowd. You know why nobody solves anything? Because there's no solutions to be had. It's far too late for solutioneering, there's no sprints here, no hackathons, absolutely nothing that can be done because the only solutions require global consensus and we still can't even all agree that wars are bad and gay marriage is good. So no, save your money and put it into hookers and blow or whatever makes you happy, as long as you can, because we're about to go off a very steep cliff and there's nothing the very smartest people on earth could do about it at this point.
roguecoder 4y ago
We can solve it. The Great Depression measurably delayed the impact of climate change, and with advances in fusion and solar technology carbon capture is rapidly becoming a reality. That we so far haven't bothered trying because it would cost rich people some money is unconscionable, but that doesn't mean it is impossible. The science of environmental repair will need a broad base of support, but it is our best hope to still be able to exist as a species.
- MisterMower 4y ago
  Are you suggesting another Great Depression would be good because it would forestall the effects of climate change?
  - thehappypm 4y ago
    That seems to be the proposal, yes. Rather than possible future problems, let’s cause them now!

javajosh 4y ago

Yeah, I've been following some climate folk on twitter. All they do is make dire warnings and ask for money. Personally, I know climate change is very real and quite dire, but so much "climate activism" seems to only exist to exist, and not to solve anything. I mean, all I want to see is a threat model and a list of realistic policies. But all I get is, "The earth is burning, and they don't care, so DONATE NOW!" Pathetic, and disheartening.

smt88 4y ago
> so much "climate activism" seems to only exist to exist, and not to solve anything. I mean, all I want to see is a threat model and a list of realistic policies. The problem is Twitter, not the activists. Real organizations and professionals in the industry write the kinds of analysis you're asking for all the time. You literally only need to Google something climate-change related and it's all you will see. They include realistic scenarios with sensitivity analyses, and they enormous troves of data that you can download yourself if you want to see where it came from. The problem isn't that this information is missing, it's that you're looking in the wrong place (and seemingly spending not even 10 seconds of effort to find it). Here are the first five Google results for "climate change scenario": - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Climate_change_scenario https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Climate_change_scenario (includes citations for further reading) - https://climatescenarios.org/primer/ https://climatescenarios.org/primer/ (explains what they are, includes citations, and overlays multiple climate models onto the same graph so you can see the differences) - https://www.nationalgeographic.com/environment/article/5-possible-climate-futures-from-the-optimistic-to-the-strange https://www.nationalgeographic.com/environment/article/5-pos... (summarizes the IPCC report, which is exactly what you're describing) - https://www.ipcc.ch/site/assets/uploads/2018/03/sres-en.pdf https://www.ipcc.ch/site/assets/uploads/2018/03/sres-en.pdf (an actual ICC report
newsclues 4y ago
When did the switch from activism to grifters occur?
- hnusersarelame 4y ago
- Lammy 4y ago
  IMO a “switch” from one to the other is the wrong way to look at it. There are plenty of people who legitimately care about the environment for the environment’s sake, like myself and probably anybody else on this website. What you should be looking for are the secondary and tertiary effects of climate legislation with a mind toward ideologies besides your own which would benefit from those effects. As always, correlation is not causation, but check out the inflection point for environmental interest among “American English” publications at the time of the first civil rights act in 1964: https://i.imgur.com/kP8ugvH.png https://i.imgur.com/kP8ugvH.png Since we’ve been picking on California in this thread this is also a good time to remember 1964 as the year California passed a state ballot proposition with the explicit intent of nullifying a state-level fair housing act passed one year earlier in 1963: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1964_California_Proposition_14 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1964_California_Proposition_14 Obviously California is a huge state with a huge number of conflicting ideologies, but I think it’s important to be mindful of ways one’s good intentions may be misdirected and misused.
yababa_y 4y ago
Like Project Drawdown? https://drawdown.org/ https://drawdown.org/
- javajosh 4y ago
  Really like that website, thanks! It's hard to find sober, practical content on climate change (with the exception of the IPCC itself).
jzellis 4y ago
That's just the usual NGO and charity crowd. You know why nobody solves anything? Because there's no solutions to be had. It's far too late for solutioneering, there's no sprints here, no hackathons, absolutely nothing that can be done because the only solutions require global consensus and we still can't even all agree that wars are bad and gay marriage is good. So no, save your money and put it into hookers and blow or whatever makes you happy, as long as you can, because we're about to go off a very steep cliff and there's nothing the very smartest people on earth could do about it at this point.

roguecoder 4y ago

We can solve it. The Great Depression measurably delayed the impact of climate change, and with advances in fusion and solar technology carbon capture is rapidly becoming a reality. That we so far haven't bothered trying because it would cost rich people some money is unconscionable, but that doesn't mean it is impossible. The science of environmental repair will need a broad base of support, but it is our best hope to still be able to exist as a species.

MisterMower 4y ago
Are you suggesting another Great Depression would be good because it would forestall the effects of climate change?
- thehappypm 4y ago
  That seems to be the proposal, yes. Rather than possible future problems, let’s cause them now!