4 ms·

The Neurotoxin Lurking in Medicine Cabinets Around the Globe

3 points by Tozen 4y ago

jleyank 4y ago
No numbers. Reads like the dhmo article. What is the risk vs, say, smoking, NOx air pollution, petroleum fumes, cooking byproducts, uva/uvb, …. There a whole lot of risky things out there, at varying effective or toxic doses. To say that X is hazardous it has to be compared to other things. How much toothpaste must you eat?
- gus_massa 4y ago
  From Wikipedia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fluoride_toxicity https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fluoride_toxicity > Referring to a common salt of fluoride, sodium fluoride (NaF), the lethal dose for most adult humans is estimated at 5 to 10 g (which is equivalent to 32 to 64 mg elemental fluoride/kg body weight). From https://www.nhs.uk/conditions/fluoride/ https://www.nhs.uk/conditions/fluoride/ > Toothpastes containing 1,350 to 1,500ppm fluoride are the most effective. Your dentist may advise you to use higher-strength toothpaste if you or your child is at particular risk of tooth decay. Let's pick the worst extremes, to eat 5g using a 1,500ppm toothpaste, you must eat 3.3Kg (7.3 pounds) of toothpaste. That's like 15 Big Mac. And assuming you eat the toothpastes instead of spitting it.
  - Tozen 4y ago
    Let's not be deceptive. A certain lethal dose of a substance does not mean that a lesser dose or sustained exposure at high levels will not cause harm or long term damaging effects (to include cancer). Many want to decrease their exposure to or remove toxins, not maintain continual exposure to them for many years and gamble with their lives for little to no benefit. Also keep in mind that people are exposed to fluoride not just in toothpaste, but in many other ways, like it being in their drinking water and/or in various fruits and vegetables (to include juices and wines) as a result of various kinds of pesticides (https://www.beyondpesticides.org/assets/media/documents/infoservices/pesticidesandyou/Spring%2001/Fluoride%20The%20Hidden%20Poison%20in%20the%20National%20Organic%20Standards.pdf https://www.beyondpesticides.org/assets/media/documents/info...).
    - jleyank 4y ago
      Careful, as small doses of some chemicals are beneficial (vitamins, etc) but large/silly doses are damaging. Even water... If you work and work at drinking it you might screw up your electrolyte balance and have problems or die. But without water, bad ju ju in a few days.
      - Tozen 4y ago
        Fluoride has no known dietary benefit to the human body, and is toxic. Just like lead and mercury are toxic, and its advisable to avoid them, not expose one's self to them (even if that's convenient or profitable to certain businesses). You appear to be making a false equivalence, as vitamin C or calcium is essential to the body and naturally beneficial to the teeth.
        jleyank 4y ago
        Wikipedia is ambivalent on "no dietary benefit" - citing possibilities in terms of teeth enamel or bone mass. Is Wikipedia correct? Unknown. Is your information correct? Unknown.
- Tozen 4y ago
  If one reads the article, they will notice there is a resources section at the bottom with links to studies with more specifics.

3 points by Tozen 4y ago

No numbers. Reads like the dhmo article. What is the risk vs, say, smoking, NOx air pollution, petroleum fumes, cooking byproducts, uva/uvb, …. There a whole lot of risky things out there, at varying effective or toxic doses. To say that X is hazardous it has to be compared to other things. How much toothpaste must you eat?

gus_massa 4y ago
From Wikipedia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fluoride_toxicity https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fluoride_toxicity > Referring to a common salt of fluoride, sodium fluoride (NaF), the lethal dose for most adult humans is estimated at 5 to 10 g (which is equivalent to 32 to 64 mg elemental fluoride/kg body weight). From https://www.nhs.uk/conditions/fluoride/ https://www.nhs.uk/conditions/fluoride/ > Toothpastes containing 1,350 to 1,500ppm fluoride are the most effective. Your dentist may advise you to use higher-strength toothpaste if you or your child is at particular risk of tooth decay. Let's pick the worst extremes, to eat 5g using a 1,500ppm toothpaste, you must eat 3.3Kg (7.3 pounds) of toothpaste. That's like 15 Big Mac. And assuming you eat the toothpastes instead of spitting it.
- Tozen 4y ago
  Let's not be deceptive. A certain lethal dose of a substance does not mean that a lesser dose or sustained exposure at high levels will not cause harm or long term damaging effects (to include cancer). Many want to decrease their exposure to or remove toxins, not maintain continual exposure to them for many years and gamble with their lives for little to no benefit. Also keep in mind that people are exposed to fluoride not just in toothpaste, but in many other ways, like it being in their drinking water and/or in various fruits and vegetables (to include juices and wines) as a result of various kinds of pesticides (https://www.beyondpesticides.org/assets/media/documents/infoservices/pesticidesandyou/Spring%2001/Fluoride%20The%20Hidden%20Poison%20in%20the%20National%20Organic%20Standards.pdf https://www.beyondpesticides.org/assets/media/documents/info...).
  - jleyank 4y ago
    Careful, as small doses of some chemicals are beneficial (vitamins, etc) but large/silly doses are damaging. Even water... If you work and work at drinking it you might screw up your electrolyte balance and have problems or die. But without water, bad ju ju in a few days.
    - Tozen 4y ago
      Fluoride has no known dietary benefit to the human body, and is toxic. Just like lead and mercury are toxic, and its advisable to avoid them, not expose one's self to them (even if that's convenient or profitable to certain businesses). You appear to be making a false equivalence, as vitamin C or calcium is essential to the body and naturally beneficial to the teeth.
      - jleyank 4y ago
        Wikipedia is ambivalent on "no dietary benefit" - citing possibilities in terms of teeth enamel or bone mass. Is Wikipedia correct? Unknown. Is your information correct? Unknown.
Tozen 4y ago
If one reads the article, they will notice there is a resources section at the bottom with links to studies with more specifics.