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I think saying subscriptions are a dark pattern is going a bit far. In the case where you're offering an ongoing service that requires a cost to service, a subs

I think saying subscriptions are a dark pattern is going a bit far. In the case where you're offering an ongoing service that requires a cost to service, a subscription model is completely appropriate and in the best interest of both the subscriber and the issuer. For sure there's some abuse of the model where you're selling something that should be a one-time item, but that's not the case here, and Mullvad is providing an ongoing service (and still billing by month / year / etc. for the service, just without automatic renewals).

3wolf 4y ago
Yeah, I'd say the term dark pattern only applies when services make it unnecessarily difficult to cancel your subscription. cough cough...NY Times
lolc 4y ago
To me, a dark pattern is when the service doesn't announce in advance when the subscription is going to renew.
- bcrosby95 4y ago
  These emails always annoy me. To each their own I guess.
wpietri 4y ago
I'd be willing to say that subscriptions are a dark pattern when they don't automatically stop if you stop using them. A fundamental part of healthy business relationships is value for value. E.g., you give me money, I give you a sandwich, you take the sandwich, eat it, and are happy with it. If you keep paying me for sandwiches but I don't give them to you, that's not healthy. Ditto if I put them on the counter but you stop taking them. Personally, I think there should be a law that all service/software subscriptions auto-suspend after 30 days of non-use. Because right now there's a big incentive for businesses to get you to sign up for things they think you're not going to use, and to keep on charging you even though they know you're not using it.
- tomnipotent 4y ago
  What you're asking for is a la carte access while still getting discounted subscription pricing, pushing all the risk onto the business. Consume as much as you want, but pay nothing when you don't. Sounds like a crap deal for the business.
  - roblabla 4y ago
    And what businesses are hoping for are users that are paying without actually using their service. Produce nothing, but get paid every month. Sounds like a crap deal for the users.
    - tomnipotent 4y ago
      > And what businesses are hoping for are users that are paying without actually using their service All of them, from the local gym to Dropbox to Spotify. Subscription businesses can't make money if every consumer costs more to service than the revenue they generate. There's even an official accounting term for it, breakage. > Produce nothing, but get paid every month Failure to consume and get value from a subscription is your fault, not the business that fulfilled its obligation.
      - wpietri 4y ago
        I am amazed that you can't see that approach as exploitative, and that your last line is victim blaming. If a company can't exist without tricking people into paying for something they get no value out of, maybe it shouldn't exist.
        tomnipotent 4y ago
        > can't see that approach as exploitative You're getting all-you-can-eat from the business for a fixed price in exchange for predictable revenue as opposed to pay-as-you-go. That you think that's exploitative just tells me you don't understand the business model. You want to have your cake and eat it, too.

3wolf 4y ago

Yeah, I'd say the term dark pattern only applies when services make it unnecessarily difficult to cancel your subscription. cough cough...NY Times

lolc 4y ago

To me, a dark pattern is when the service doesn't announce in advance when the subscription is going to renew.

bcrosby95 4y ago
These emails always annoy me. To each their own I guess.

wpietri 4y ago

I'd be willing to say that subscriptions are a dark pattern when they don't automatically stop if you stop using them. A fundamental part of healthy business relationships is value for value. E.g., you give me money, I give you a sandwich, you take the sandwich, eat it, and are happy with it. If you keep paying me for sandwiches but I don't give them to you, that's not healthy. Ditto if I put them on the counter but you stop taking them. Personally, I think there should be a law that all service/software subscriptions auto-suspend after 30 days of non-use. Because right now there's a big incentive for businesses to get you to sign up for things they think you're not going to use, and to keep on charging you even though they know you're not using it.

tomnipotent 4y ago
What you're asking for is a la carte access while still getting discounted subscription pricing, pushing all the risk onto the business. Consume as much as you want, but pay nothing when you don't. Sounds like a crap deal for the business.
- roblabla 4y ago
  And what businesses are hoping for are users that are paying without actually using their service. Produce nothing, but get paid every month. Sounds like a crap deal for the users.
  - tomnipotent 4y ago
    > And what businesses are hoping for are users that are paying without actually using their service All of them, from the local gym to Dropbox to Spotify. Subscription businesses can't make money if every consumer costs more to service than the revenue they generate. There's even an official accounting term for it, breakage. > Produce nothing, but get paid every month Failure to consume and get value from a subscription is your fault, not the business that fulfilled its obligation.
    - wpietri 4y ago
      I am amazed that you can't see that approach as exploitative, and that your last line is victim blaming. If a company can't exist without tricking people into paying for something they get no value out of, maybe it shouldn't exist.
      - tomnipotent 4y ago
        > can't see that approach as exploitative You're getting all-you-can-eat from the business for a fixed price in exchange for predictable revenue as opposed to pay-as-you-go. That you think that's exploitative just tells me you don't understand the business model. You want to have your cake and eat it, too.