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> My housekeeper does, and so do the guys who collect my garbage. They're never going to be financially stable in the way I am, though. This just seems overly

> My housekeeper does, and so do the guys who collect my garbage. They're never going to be financially stable in the way I am, though. This just seems overly reductive in the opposite direction. Do you not know any housekeepers or garbage collectors? It feels like you're going so far out of your way to try to make the person you're responding to feel sorry for them that you're being cruel and dismissive. My mother-in-law was an immigrant housekeeper who over the course of her life eventually became a well paid live-in private chef, for example. And even if someone doesn't become rich they can often provide for subsequent generations. My Dad was able to become a doctor because his immigrant construction laborer father was able to give him enough stability to do well in school. This thread is about having compassion, and certainly the top level comment lacks it. But your comment also kind of lacks it? I know it tries to, but it feels very condescending to me, and takes the agency from vast swathes of people. I can't imagine hanging out among "housekeepers and garbage collectors" and not seeing that they're just people, too, and some are among a vibrant community and have dreams and aspirations for themselves or their children, and hearing bragging of all the success stories of those who have become financially stable the way you are.

smt88 4y ago
> Do you not know any housekeepers or garbage collectors? I know my housekeeper very well. We're friends, we've played online games together, and he's cleaned for me for almost 10 years. I help him with his side hustles whenever I can. > It feels like you're going so far out of your way to try to make the person you're responding to feel sorry for them that you're being cruel and dismissive. This is a bizarre reading of my comment. I was trying to think of the hardest-working people I know. I didn't choose them because they are people to pity. Upward mobility in the US is at its lowest in several generations[1]. That's my whole point. > My mother-in-law was an immigrant housekeeper who over the course of her life eventually became a well paid live-in private chef, for example. Great! Doesn't change my point. I don't work as hard as a garbage collector, and I earn 6x what a garbage collector in my city makes by working as a privileged software developer. These people may be financially stable and have good lives, but they won't have money thrown at them the way I (and a lot of software developers) have. > I know it tries to, but it feels very condescending to me, and takes the agency from vast swathes of people. Yes, that is my whole point. We live in a society that takes away people's agency. They can work tirelessly and still not have the "pedigree" that a lot of companies look for. A lot of our society is determined by which family you're lucky enough to be born in, and that is what has taken people's agency away. As for the rest of it, I can't control how you interpret my words. I feel condescending toward people who are lucky like me and don't realize it. I don't feel condescending toward people who work hard and take care of their families. 1. https://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2016/07/social-mobility-america/491240/ https://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2016/07/social-...

smt88 4y ago

> Do you not know any housekeepers or garbage collectors? I know my housekeeper very well. We're friends, we've played online games together, and he's cleaned for me for almost 10 years. I help him with his side hustles whenever I can. > It feels like you're going so far out of your way to try to make the person you're responding to feel sorry for them that you're being cruel and dismissive. This is a bizarre reading of my comment. I was trying to think of the hardest-working people I know. I didn't choose them because they are people to pity. Upward mobility in the US is at its lowest in several generations[1]. That's my whole point. > My mother-in-law was an immigrant housekeeper who over the course of her life eventually became a well paid live-in private chef, for example. Great! Doesn't change my point. I don't work as hard as a garbage collector, and I earn 6x what a garbage collector in my city makes by working as a privileged software developer. These people may be financially stable and have good lives, but they won't have money thrown at them the way I (and a lot of software developers) have. > I know it tries to, but it feels very condescending to me, and takes the agency from vast swathes of people. Yes, that is my whole point. We live in a society that takes away people's agency. They can work tirelessly and still not have the "pedigree" that a lot of companies look for. A lot of our society is determined by which family you're lucky enough to be born in, and that is what has taken people's agency away. As for the rest of it, I can't control how you interpret my words. I feel condescending toward people who are lucky like me and don't realize it. I don't feel condescending toward people who work hard and take care of their families. 1. https://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2016/07/social-mobility-america/491240/ https://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2016/07/social-...