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It depends on what you think the problem is. Is the problem that the company you’re working for has bad managers? Is your goal to ensure that there are absolut

It depends on what you think the problem is. Is the problem that the company you’re working for has bad managers? Is your goal to ensure that there are absolutely no bad managers in a company the size of Spotify? Because that sounds like a Sisyphean task on a good day. If that isn’t the goal then why is switching managers not a perfectly adequate solution? And about making it someone else’s problem, potentially that person may get on better with the manager and they may both be more effective. Alternatively, when there is a second person who also chooses to change, that would lead to either the manager reconsidering their approach or the manager’s manager wondering why no one sticks under them. If the company has a decent HR policy they will allow for anonymous feedback on the manager and when it gets similar feedback from multiple people they can work on improving the managers training and/or get rid of them.

nailer 4y ago
> Is the problem that the company you’re working for has bad managers? No, obviously not. > Is your goal to ensure that there are absolutely no bad managers in a company the size of Spotify? No, obviously not. I believe the OPs goal was improve a specific failing manager. I think he didn't do this very well, but let's not straw man him.
- addicted 4y ago
  I wasn’t responding to the OP but the idea that somehow changing managers is complacent and/or punting the problem to someone else. Employees have 0 responsibility or incentive to improve their managers (the converse is not true). In fact, it’s a terrible idea to do so, because there’s probably only single digit % of managers who would take that positively, if even. Especially if it isn’t the manager taking the initiative to ask for improvement ideas.
  - nailer 4y ago
    > I wasn’t responding to the OP but the idea that somehow changing managers is complacent and/or punting the problem to someone else. It isn't? Whoever inherits the role will have the same issues, so how isn't swapping teams punting the issue to someone else? > Employees have 0 responsibility or incentive to improve their managers (the converse is not true). Employees have a responsibility to make sure their job gets done, and can (and should) identify obstructions to that happening. > there’s probably only single digit % of managers who would take that positively, if even. 'Managing up' is a well-known and fairly common skill at large companies.

nailer 4y ago

> Is the problem that the company you’re working for has bad managers? No, obviously not. > Is your goal to ensure that there are absolutely no bad managers in a company the size of Spotify? No, obviously not. I believe the OPs goal was improve a specific failing manager. I think he didn't do this very well, but let's not straw man him.

addicted 4y ago
I wasn’t responding to the OP but the idea that somehow changing managers is complacent and/or punting the problem to someone else. Employees have 0 responsibility or incentive to improve their managers (the converse is not true). In fact, it’s a terrible idea to do so, because there’s probably only single digit % of managers who would take that positively, if even. Especially if it isn’t the manager taking the initiative to ask for improvement ideas.
- nailer 4y ago
  > I wasn’t responding to the OP but the idea that somehow changing managers is complacent and/or punting the problem to someone else. It isn't? Whoever inherits the role will have the same issues, so how isn't swapping teams punting the issue to someone else? > Employees have 0 responsibility or incentive to improve their managers (the converse is not true). Employees have a responsibility to make sure their job gets done, and can (and should) identify obstructions to that happening. > there’s probably only single digit % of managers who would take that positively, if even. 'Managing up' is a well-known and fairly common skill at large companies.