5 ms·

Dissatisfaction in the Tesla factory in Grünheide: employees are leaving

24 points by nixass 4y ago

netgusto 4y ago
In english: https://www-stern-de.translate.goog/auto/e-mobilitaet/unzufriedenheit-bei-tesla-in-gruenheide--beschaeftigte-verlassen-unternehmen-31961868.html?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en&_x_tr_pto=wapp https://www-stern-de.translate.goog/auto/e-mobilitaet/unzufr... TL;DR "The mood is shifting mainly because of unequal wages [...] Because new hires would be paid better than other employees."
- hansword 4y ago
  Also the union rep says that the region (Brandenburg state, Giga Berlin is not in Berlin) has a severe lack of professionally trained skilled workers, so it's easy to find another job. The onky solution, they say, is for Tesla to raise wages.
ThePhysicist 4y ago
When they got started I had a look at the advertised software engineering positions. They openly wrote that candidates must be OK "working nights and weekends without extra compensation". Writing something like that into a job ad (which they stopped doing, probably because they realized it's simply illegal in Germany) seemed really toxic to me, though I guess at least they were honest about it.
- velmu 4y ago
  Do it for the mission!
- spupe 4y ago
  I think they will have a very hard time recruiting in Germany. There is certainly no patience for this permanent crunch, anti-union attitude that seems characteristic of Tesla in the US.
  - sofixa 4y ago
    It's the same mistake Walmart and initially McDonalds did, they think their usual crap will fly in Europe, and it just doesn't. You need to adapt to the local market's specifics ( it's also why EU based companies have a harder time growing than US based ones - the single market still required a lot of adaptations).
- senectus1 4y ago
  so stupidly ham fisted and fucking entitled as well. you CAN get people to do this sort of work, and even get them to do it for free... but you have to BRING the team to it, people dont work their best and go the extra step because they're being paid. That sort of work is done by people for love and because the believe in the vision. Telling people up front thats what you expect... that gets you exactly the wrong sort of people if you get anyone at all.
  - piva00 4y ago
    > you CAN get people to do this sort of work, and even get them to do it for free... but you have to BRING the team to it, people dont work their best and go the extra step because they're being paid. That sort of work is done by people for love and because the believe in the vision. This is just exploitation, like in any industry driven by passion: film, music, game development and so on. If you, as a capitalist, manipulate people using their passion to be paid less you are completely morally corrupt.
- breadloaf 4y ago
  This is really dumb on many levels. They can pull nights and weekends when project needs to be done. But they need to pay for it and it is mentally impossible to do it consistently for weeks or even months. After some time you will just burn out like a flare.
  - effingwewt 4y ago
    This is how American companies work now. They believe it's better to ask forgiveness than permission, and view fines as the 'cost of doing business' Employees are a resource to be consumed and replaced in cycle. People break laws and go to jail. Companies break laws and hit record profits. Wage theft runs rampant here in the US, every business owner took PPP loans whether they needed it or not. I'm so thankful y'all are still reasonable humans who see this garbage for what it is and stop it.
alexnewman 4y ago
Basically impossible to compete with people who love their job and want to do it all the time. Before I got into software I tried making Italian food. Hardest work I ever did. Now that I’m making software I often work nights and weekends because I enjoy it so much. I Often skip days though. The flexibility is very good for my mental health. Guess I shouldn’t move to Germany.
- tillk 4y ago
  You confuse flexible working hours with a demand to work more than 40 hours a week (including nights and weekends). If you (like to) work overtime on the weekend or week nights, I hope you are compensated well. Just take into account that there’s a cap on what you can do and no amount of money will make up for that.
- piva00 4y ago
  > Now that I’m making software I often work nights and weekends because I enjoy it so much. I used to be like that in the beginning of my career. Before working, writing code was a major hobby since I was a kid. Now, after 18 years of career, this is just a recipe for burnout. And if you work in a team, it's a recipe to dump unnecessary stress unto others, they see you working on weekends and nights, some of them will feel inadequate and try to compensate and mimic you. Most can't really push that in a sustainable and healthy way so they'll burnout. I hope you are working like that in a very async manner, where you can work on flexible hours, etc. If you aren't and you are working on a team environment, you might just be causing issues without even realising it (or perhaps not, it all depends on the people you are working with). Generally, in my experience, this isn't sustainable for a team. And yes, I guess you shouldn't move to Germany, even though they work longer hours than us here in Sweden manager still don't tolerate much of someone burning the midnight oil...
  - alexnewman 4y ago
    I’ve been coding for 30 years . Professionally for 25. As I grow older I work faster and longer. I now have many contractors in Germany and sweeden and they prefer working for me over locals because of the flexability i provide. I wouldn’t stereotype Americans or people in Europe. I still code everyday. I haven’t needed to work for money for 15 years. For me my family and work give me meaning. I find both to be recharging and am depressed by drinking and tv watching. Drinking and tv watching seems what most people do most of the time as opposed to family and building time
akmarinov 4y ago
Tesla chose Germany so that they could be seen as a proper big manufacturer- now they bear the fruits. If they wanted slave work, they should’ve gone to Turkey or the Balkans.
- bestouff 4y ago
  At least they didn't choose France.
tontonius 4y ago
I'd be cautious to draw large conclusions based on this piece. At the core, it's a trade unionist (w/ friends) complaining on low or uneven salaries. This is pretty much the purpose of unions. Ask a hair dresser if you need a haricut <-> ask a unionist if the wages are too low
NickRandom 4y ago
If somebody is going to post a foreign language page that's fine - but at least have the decency to use the article title (which is 'Unzufriedenheit in Tesla-Fabrik Grünheide: Beschäftigte verlassen das Unternehmen'). Or find a different version.
- nixass 4y ago
  There's character limit. Also the link was posted with google translated link which was removed during posting (not by me)
- xigurat 4y ago
  This is a global website that operates on the World Wide Web. Even if the main language of the content here is English, what is "foreign" to you might not be foreign to others. I'm sure many users here are non native English.
  - hansword 4y ago
    Nick says it is bad practice to post an x-language article, but change the title into y-language. That x is German and y is English isn't that important. It's about wrongly signaling to the reader, who then after clicking is confused.

24 points by nixass 4y ago

In english: https://www-stern-de.translate.goog/auto/e-mobilitaet/unzufriedenheit-bei-tesla-in-gruenheide--beschaeftigte-verlassen-unternehmen-31961868.html?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en&_x_tr_pto=wapp https://www-stern-de.translate.goog/auto/e-mobilitaet/unzufr... TL;DR "The mood is shifting mainly because of unequal wages [...] Because new hires would be paid better than other employees."

hansword 4y ago
Also the union rep says that the region (Brandenburg state, Giga Berlin is not in Berlin) has a severe lack of professionally trained skilled workers, so it's easy to find another job. The onky solution, they say, is for Tesla to raise wages.

ThePhysicist 4y ago

When they got started I had a look at the advertised software engineering positions. They openly wrote that candidates must be OK "working nights and weekends without extra compensation". Writing something like that into a job ad (which they stopped doing, probably because they realized it's simply illegal in Germany) seemed really toxic to me, though I guess at least they were honest about it.

velmu 4y ago
Do it for the mission!
spupe 4y ago
I think they will have a very hard time recruiting in Germany. There is certainly no patience for this permanent crunch, anti-union attitude that seems characteristic of Tesla in the US.
- sofixa 4y ago
  It's the same mistake Walmart and initially McDonalds did, they think their usual crap will fly in Europe, and it just doesn't. You need to adapt to the local market's specifics ( it's also why EU based companies have a harder time growing than US based ones - the single market still required a lot of adaptations).
senectus1 4y ago
so stupidly ham fisted and fucking entitled as well. you CAN get people to do this sort of work, and even get them to do it for free... but you have to BRING the team to it, people dont work their best and go the extra step because they're being paid. That sort of work is done by people for love and because the believe in the vision. Telling people up front thats what you expect... that gets you exactly the wrong sort of people if you get anyone at all.
- piva00 4y ago
  > you CAN get people to do this sort of work, and even get them to do it for free... but you have to BRING the team to it, people dont work their best and go the extra step because they're being paid. That sort of work is done by people for love and because the believe in the vision. This is just exploitation, like in any industry driven by passion: film, music, game development and so on. If you, as a capitalist, manipulate people using their passion to be paid less you are completely morally corrupt.
breadloaf 4y ago
This is really dumb on many levels. They can pull nights and weekends when project needs to be done. But they need to pay for it and it is mentally impossible to do it consistently for weeks or even months. After some time you will just burn out like a flare.
- effingwewt 4y ago
  This is how American companies work now. They believe it's better to ask forgiveness than permission, and view fines as the 'cost of doing business' Employees are a resource to be consumed and replaced in cycle. People break laws and go to jail. Companies break laws and hit record profits. Wage theft runs rampant here in the US, every business owner took PPP loans whether they needed it or not. I'm so thankful y'all are still reasonable humans who see this garbage for what it is and stop it.

alexnewman 4y ago

Basically impossible to compete with people who love their job and want to do it all the time. Before I got into software I tried making Italian food. Hardest work I ever did. Now that I’m making software I often work nights and weekends because I enjoy it so much. I Often skip days though. The flexibility is very good for my mental health. Guess I shouldn’t move to Germany.

tillk 4y ago
You confuse flexible working hours with a demand to work more than 40 hours a week (including nights and weekends). If you (like to) work overtime on the weekend or week nights, I hope you are compensated well. Just take into account that there’s a cap on what you can do and no amount of money will make up for that.
piva00 4y ago
> Now that I’m making software I often work nights and weekends because I enjoy it so much. I used to be like that in the beginning of my career. Before working, writing code was a major hobby since I was a kid. Now, after 18 years of career, this is just a recipe for burnout. And if you work in a team, it's a recipe to dump unnecessary stress unto others, they see you working on weekends and nights, some of them will feel inadequate and try to compensate and mimic you. Most can't really push that in a sustainable and healthy way so they'll burnout. I hope you are working like that in a very async manner, where you can work on flexible hours, etc. If you aren't and you are working on a team environment, you might just be causing issues without even realising it (or perhaps not, it all depends on the people you are working with). Generally, in my experience, this isn't sustainable for a team. And yes, I guess you shouldn't move to Germany, even though they work longer hours than us here in Sweden manager still don't tolerate much of someone burning the midnight oil...
- alexnewman 4y ago
  I’ve been coding for 30 years . Professionally for 25. As I grow older I work faster and longer. I now have many contractors in Germany and sweeden and they prefer working for me over locals because of the flexability i provide. I wouldn’t stereotype Americans or people in Europe. I still code everyday. I haven’t needed to work for money for 15 years. For me my family and work give me meaning. I find both to be recharging and am depressed by drinking and tv watching. Drinking and tv watching seems what most people do most of the time as opposed to family and building time

akmarinov 4y ago

Tesla chose Germany so that they could be seen as a proper big manufacturer- now they bear the fruits. If they wanted slave work, they should’ve gone to Turkey or the Balkans.

bestouff 4y ago
At least they didn't choose France.

tontonius 4y ago

I'd be cautious to draw large conclusions based on this piece. At the core, it's a trade unionist (w/ friends) complaining on low or uneven salaries. This is pretty much the purpose of unions. Ask a hair dresser if you need a haricut <-> ask a unionist if the wages are too low

NickRandom 4y ago

If somebody is going to post a foreign language page that's fine - but at least have the decency to use the article title (which is 'Unzufriedenheit in Tesla-Fabrik Grünheide: Beschäftigte verlassen das Unternehmen'). Or find a different version.

nixass 4y ago
There's character limit. Also the link was posted with google translated link which was removed during posting (not by me)
xigurat 4y ago
This is a global website that operates on the World Wide Web. Even if the main language of the content here is English, what is "foreign" to you might not be foreign to others. I'm sure many users here are non native English.
- hansword 4y ago
  Nick says it is bad practice to post an x-language article, but change the title into y-language. That x is German and y is English isn't that important. It's about wrongly signaling to the reader, who then after clicking is confused.