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There's nothing to address. Telegram chats are encrypted to and from the server, they're not E2E encrypted, they do not claim to be by default. They do offer E2

by dymk 4y ago

There's nothing to address. Telegram chats are encrypted to and from the server, they're not E2E encrypted, they do not claim to be by default. They do offer E2E chats you can opt into, and there has not been a single example of an E2E message being cracked.

bjoli 4y ago
The telegram web page claims on the first page: > Telegram messages are heavily encrypted and can self-destruct. How is Joe Average supposed to understand that? Adding to that, the secret chat encryption has always been Weird (capital W) and in one of the previous generations the server could actually MITM it. Trivially.
- tryauuum 4y ago
  > How is Joe Average supposed to understand that? That's an interesting question. I don't know. Maybe he would understand it as "messages that are hard to read for NSA". To be honest, I don't understand your criticism. Surely people can put a video on their website about E2E, about privacy, integrity and authenticity. Maybe put an honest comparison with other messengers. But I'd only expect this kind of openness from a nonprofit organization.
milansuk 4y ago
All HTTPS connections(most of web browsing last decade) are encrypted to and from the server. Signal showed us that is possible to have E2E encrypted messaging, why don't they provide it, but with better UI/UX? If Telegram doesn't read messages and doesn't provide access for 3rd parties(governments, etc.), It should provide E2E everywhere by default.
- fritigern 4y ago
  Can you get E2EE and also have multiple devices all sync'd? This is awful in Signal, it barely works to have multiple devices.
  - kriops 4y ago
    Yes, see Matrix. And imo generally better UX than Telegram on account of having a large selection of clients.
    - lucb1e 4y ago
      You're the first that I hear saying something has better UX than Telegram, and a Matrix client at that. Power to you, but from my experience with everything from Telegram to Threema and a lot in between, it sounds odd to me.
- afiori 4y ago
  > If Telegram doesn't read messages Telegram offers server side text search
  - tcfhgj 4y ago
    You could do that with e2ee though https://matrix-org.github.io/gsoc/#/projects?project=implement_encrypted_search_for_matrix&lang=en https://matrix-org.github.io/gsoc/#/projects?project=impleme...

by dymk 4y ago

bjoli 4y ago

The telegram web page claims on the first page: > Telegram messages are heavily encrypted and can self-destruct. How is Joe Average supposed to understand that? Adding to that, the secret chat encryption has always been Weird (capital W) and in one of the previous generations the server could actually MITM it. Trivially.

tryauuum 4y ago
> How is Joe Average supposed to understand that? That's an interesting question. I don't know. Maybe he would understand it as "messages that are hard to read for NSA". To be honest, I don't understand your criticism. Surely people can put a video on their website about E2E, about privacy, integrity and authenticity. Maybe put an honest comparison with other messengers. But I'd only expect this kind of openness from a nonprofit organization.

milansuk 4y ago

All HTTPS connections(most of web browsing last decade) are encrypted to and from the server. Signal showed us that is possible to have E2E encrypted messaging, why don't they provide it, but with better UI/UX? If Telegram doesn't read messages and doesn't provide access for 3rd parties(governments, etc.), It should provide E2E everywhere by default.

fritigern 4y ago
Can you get E2EE and also have multiple devices all sync'd? This is awful in Signal, it barely works to have multiple devices.
- kriops 4y ago
  Yes, see Matrix. And imo generally better UX than Telegram on account of having a large selection of clients.
  - lucb1e 4y ago
    You're the first that I hear saying something has better UX than Telegram, and a Matrix client at that. Power to you, but from my experience with everything from Telegram to Threema and a lot in between, it sounds odd to me.
afiori 4y ago
> If Telegram doesn't read messages Telegram offers server side text search
- tcfhgj 4y ago
  You could do that with e2ee though https://matrix-org.github.io/gsoc/#/projects?project=implement_encrypted_search_for_matrix&lang=en https://matrix-org.github.io/gsoc/#/projects?project=impleme...