4 ms·

> I'd love to eat plants a lot. Just turns out they give me depression.(takes about 4 days after ingestion) Eat a diverse low-fat, whole plant-based diet - if

by myshpa 4y ago

> I'd love to eat plants a lot. Just turns out they give me depression.(takes about 4 days after ingestion) Eat a diverse low-fat, whole plant-based diet - if you don't how or what, find yourself a weekly vegan meal plan. Supplement with B12 and you'll be fine. Learn to cook, explore vegan meals/recipes from around the world, stay away from processed food. > There is something called bio-availability and there are nutrients in meat that you don't ever get from plants. That's a lie you've been told. Plants are enough (again, don't forget your B12 vegan supplements). > Transportation is the biggest co2 producer... Transport, processing, retail & packaging is a miniscule part in CO2 production compared to land use change & farming. [https://ychef.files.bbci.co.uk/1600x900/p0c41fcj.webp https://ychef.files.bbci.co.uk/1600x900/p0c41fcj.webp - Emissions (in kg CO2e) from the food supply chain – the climate impact of food miles is often a small proportion (Source: Our World in Data/Poore and Nemecek, Science, 2018), linked from ] [https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20220429-the-climate-bene https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20220429-the-climate-bene...]

koide 4y ago
It depends. Humans vary and, while you may thrive on a plant diet, you can't generalize your experience. There are people who have problems even supplementing B12. Others don't. You can't just tell those who have that they've been living a lie.
- myshpa 4y ago
  I know that there are always exceptions and that some, i repeat some, will have problems on a plant diet. But it will be IMHO a miniscule percent/promile, not a majority. > there are nutrients in meat that you don't ever get from plants Plant-Based Diets Are Not Nutritionally Deficient https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3854817/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3854817/ "More than a half-century of creative marketing by the meat, dairy, egg, and fish industries has produced fears surrounding nonexistent deficiencies, which in clinical practice need no patient monitoring by physicians and dietitians"
  - koide 4y ago
    Until there are actual serious studies with a large sample population from different parts of the world you can't be sure how many people will be affected and how. Also how healthily you eat is paramount. You can eat vegan trash too. Btw, while I didn't say the line you're quoting about nutrients missing from plants, the article you're quoting is not very serious looking, with references that 404 and no way to find the actual data that I could find.
cheese_goddess 4y ago
Wow way to mislead with graphics! This is where your first plot comes from: https://ourworldindata.org/food-choice-vs-eating-local https://ourworldindata.org/food-choice-vs-eating-local And it doesn't say that transport etc is a miniscule part in CO2 production. It says that of all emissions from farming, transport is a small part compared to land use change. But you present it like it's emissions from farming compared to all other emissions. Way to go! > That's a lie you've been told. Plants are enough (again, don't forget your B12 vegan supplements). Plants are enough but you need B12 supplements? What for?
- myshpa 4y ago
  I don't intend to mislead anyone. > transport is a small part compared to land use change Transport is a small part not only to land use change, but also to farming, animal feed and processing. See the graph. > Plants are enough but you need B12 supplements? What for? B12 is necessary vitamin. Most people get their B12 from animal-based foods. But animals do not produce B12, it just bioaccumulates in them. My argument is, that we can go directly to the source (e.g. bacteria) and make supplements instead from vegan sources, free of harm & suffering.
  - cheese_goddess 4y ago
    > See the graph. I saw the graph. You're using it wrong. > B12 is necessary vitamin. Most people get their B12 from animal-based foods. But animals do not produce B12, it just bioaccumulates in them. My argument is, that we can go directly to the source (e.g. bacteria) and make supplements instead from vegan sources, free of harm & suffering. So plants are not enough?
    - myshpa 4y ago
      > You're using it wrong. You like cheese, I get it. Care to elaborate? > So plants are not enough? Yes, they are. See my other comment to you in this discussion (I've even listed some numbers for you). But I've got a hunch not even that will be enough for you. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cognitive_dissonance https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cognitive_dissonance [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UcN7SGGoCNI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UcN7SGGoCNI - Dairy is scary !

by myshpa 4y ago

koide 4y ago

It depends. Humans vary and, while you may thrive on a plant diet, you can't generalize your experience. There are people who have problems even supplementing B12. Others don't. You can't just tell those who have that they've been living a lie.

myshpa 4y ago
I know that there are always exceptions and that some, i repeat some, will have problems on a plant diet. But it will be IMHO a miniscule percent/promile, not a majority. > there are nutrients in meat that you don't ever get from plants Plant-Based Diets Are Not Nutritionally Deficient https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3854817/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3854817/ "More than a half-century of creative marketing by the meat, dairy, egg, and fish industries has produced fears surrounding nonexistent deficiencies, which in clinical practice need no patient monitoring by physicians and dietitians"
- koide 4y ago
  Until there are actual serious studies with a large sample population from different parts of the world you can't be sure how many people will be affected and how. Also how healthily you eat is paramount. You can eat vegan trash too. Btw, while I didn't say the line you're quoting about nutrients missing from plants, the article you're quoting is not very serious looking, with references that 404 and no way to find the actual data that I could find.

cheese_goddess 4y ago

Wow way to mislead with graphics! This is where your first plot comes from: https://ourworldindata.org/food-choice-vs-eating-local https://ourworldindata.org/food-choice-vs-eating-local And it doesn't say that transport etc is a miniscule part in CO2 production. It says that of all emissions from farming, transport is a small part compared to land use change. But you present it like it's emissions from farming compared to all other emissions. Way to go! > That's a lie you've been told. Plants are enough (again, don't forget your B12 vegan supplements). Plants are enough but you need B12 supplements? What for?

myshpa 4y ago
I don't intend to mislead anyone. > transport is a small part compared to land use change Transport is a small part not only to land use change, but also to farming, animal feed and processing. See the graph. > Plants are enough but you need B12 supplements? What for? B12 is necessary vitamin. Most people get their B12 from animal-based foods. But animals do not produce B12, it just bioaccumulates in them. My argument is, that we can go directly to the source (e.g. bacteria) and make supplements instead from vegan sources, free of harm & suffering.
- cheese_goddess 4y ago
  > See the graph. I saw the graph. You're using it wrong. > B12 is necessary vitamin. Most people get their B12 from animal-based foods. But animals do not produce B12, it just bioaccumulates in them. My argument is, that we can go directly to the source (e.g. bacteria) and make supplements instead from vegan sources, free of harm & suffering. So plants are not enough?
  - myshpa 4y ago
    > You're using it wrong. You like cheese, I get it. Care to elaborate? > So plants are not enough? Yes, they are. See my other comment to you in this discussion (I've even listed some numbers for you). But I've got a hunch not even that will be enough for you. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cognitive_dissonance https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cognitive_dissonance [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UcN7SGGoCNI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UcN7SGGoCNI - Dairy is scary !