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In my opinion, the work Ive did at Apple is greatly over rated. Yes it is clean and minimalist, and some devices like the iPhone 4 were truly innovative, bold

In my opinion, the work Ive did at Apple is greatly over rated. Yes it is clean and minimalist, and some devices like the iPhone 4 were truly innovative, bold and impressive designs. But overall, this is mostly bland, generic, boring. In the same minimalist style, I prefer the work of Dieter Rams. Some Sony products have really good design, including devices that were released a few years before the iPhone, but that were unfortunately built around a weak and already dying software stack (PalmOS). The Sony Clié are, in my opinion, less boring and better designed than most Apple products. IBM comes also to mind, the ThinkPad was a stylish and sturdy computer. There is a world outside of Apple headquarter, and I feel that they reached a dead-end, design wise.

deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
newsclues 4y ago
Sony worked with apple on early PowerBooks
jiggawatts 4y ago
Citing IBM as good at design makes this read like a parody. Everything IBM does is so hilariously ugly in the least imaginative, boring, industrial way that they’ve gone through “boxy” into some other universe where it’s almost — but not quite — good style. For crying out loud, everything they make is black. There are famous Apple ads deriding the bland corporate look of IBM!
- goosedragons 4y ago
  IBM has made lots of not black things. Were any of their typewriters black? The IBM PC sure wasn't and many models after that weren't. I think the ThinkPad was their first black computer at the very least. IMO ThinkPads look great and they've done some really cool things like the butterfly keyboard.
  - formerly_proven 4y ago
    > Were any of their typewriters black? Yeah, both in their electric and Selectric lineup.
- Aloha 4y ago
  The ThinkPad is and was it's own world of design, it was well thought of at the time of its introduction - because it looked different than other laptops.
  - sundvor 4y ago
    And they designed it with channels to egress a water spill into the keyboard past critical components, thus providing a very reasonable chance of laptop survival. Unlike Apple who put the high power display powerline immediately next to the CPU one. One drop, and the CPU is gone. (IIRC from Rossman's repair videos).
- stephc_int13 4y ago
  From my point of view, the beige boxes era was ugly, but there have been many interesting and innovative designs over the years. In my opinion, there should be enough space for multiple design schools and trends. https://archive.curbed.com/2016/8/31/12700054/richard-sapper-design-IBM-apple https://archive.curbed.com/2016/8/31/12700054/richard-sapper...
- sportslife 4y ago
  Maybe that was past-tense good: The first all black computer I got to use was the most beautiful, amazing machine I had ever seen. It looked fast! Unlike the plodding old beige Macintoshes I had been using. But that was a long, long time ago. Design is funny: what was new and amazing eventually becomes old and dated, and then sometimes, later still, beloved.
- karaterobot 4y ago
  You're mixing up design and style. The Thinkpad was very well designed, in that it solved a problem well given a set of requirements and constraints. It was a workhorse laptop meant for business travelers, not a consumer device like the iPhone. Both were well designed, but for different purposes.
- daniel_reetz 4y ago
  I'd strongly recommend checking out the work of Richard Sapper. he's like an Ive from a mirror universe. His design is really excellent, delightful, and absolutely user- focused. I wish Sapper's vision had won.
- derefr 4y ago
  > Everything IBM does is so hilariously ugly in the least imaginative, boring, industrial way Their mainframes and HPC clusters have a sort of "intentional brutalism", almost skewing into a "dystopian, corpocratic sci-fi evil-idol the protagonist blows up at the end of the movie" look, that's actually kind of appealing/fitting for what those clusters are/do. It's the "Hugo Boss SS uniform" of computing.
- likeclockwork 4y ago
  Black is the appropriate color for electronics.
- unsafecast 4y ago
  This is an IBM mainframe from the early 60s: https://static.righto.com/images/1401-boot/1401.jpg https://static.righto.com/images/1401-boot/1401.jpg I don't know about you but this is beautiful.

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]

newsclues 4y ago

Sony worked with apple on early PowerBooks

jiggawatts 4y ago

Citing IBM as good at design makes this read like a parody. Everything IBM does is so hilariously ugly in the least imaginative, boring, industrial way that they’ve gone through “boxy” into some other universe where it’s almost — but not quite — good style. For crying out loud, everything they make is black. There are famous Apple ads deriding the bland corporate look of IBM!

goosedragons 4y ago
IBM has made lots of not black things. Were any of their typewriters black? The IBM PC sure wasn't and many models after that weren't. I think the ThinkPad was their first black computer at the very least. IMO ThinkPads look great and they've done some really cool things like the butterfly keyboard.
- formerly_proven 4y ago
  > Were any of their typewriters black? Yeah, both in their electric and Selectric lineup.
Aloha 4y ago
The ThinkPad is and was it's own world of design, it was well thought of at the time of its introduction - because it looked different than other laptops.
- sundvor 4y ago
  And they designed it with channels to egress a water spill into the keyboard past critical components, thus providing a very reasonable chance of laptop survival. Unlike Apple who put the high power display powerline immediately next to the CPU one. One drop, and the CPU is gone. (IIRC from Rossman's repair videos).
stephc_int13 4y ago
From my point of view, the beige boxes era was ugly, but there have been many interesting and innovative designs over the years. In my opinion, there should be enough space for multiple design schools and trends. https://archive.curbed.com/2016/8/31/12700054/richard-sapper-design-IBM-apple https://archive.curbed.com/2016/8/31/12700054/richard-sapper...
sportslife 4y ago
Maybe that was past-tense good: The first all black computer I got to use was the most beautiful, amazing machine I had ever seen. It looked fast! Unlike the plodding old beige Macintoshes I had been using. But that was a long, long time ago. Design is funny: what was new and amazing eventually becomes old and dated, and then sometimes, later still, beloved.
karaterobot 4y ago
You're mixing up design and style. The Thinkpad was very well designed, in that it solved a problem well given a set of requirements and constraints. It was a workhorse laptop meant for business travelers, not a consumer device like the iPhone. Both were well designed, but for different purposes.
daniel_reetz 4y ago
I'd strongly recommend checking out the work of Richard Sapper. he's like an Ive from a mirror universe. His design is really excellent, delightful, and absolutely user- focused. I wish Sapper's vision had won.
derefr 4y ago
> Everything IBM does is so hilariously ugly in the least imaginative, boring, industrial way Their mainframes and HPC clusters have a sort of "intentional brutalism", almost skewing into a "dystopian, corpocratic sci-fi evil-idol the protagonist blows up at the end of the movie" look, that's actually kind of appealing/fitting for what those clusters are/do. It's the "Hugo Boss SS uniform" of computing.
likeclockwork 4y ago
Black is the appropriate color for electronics.
unsafecast 4y ago
This is an IBM mainframe from the early 60s: https://static.righto.com/images/1401-boot/1401.jpg https://static.righto.com/images/1401-boot/1401.jpg I don't know about you but this is beautiful.