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It is a truth universally acknowledged, that any blog post by Dave Winer must reference how he "blazed a trail" or some variation thereof.
by wyclif 15y ago
It is a truth universally acknowledged, that any blog post by Dave Winer must reference how he "blazed a trail" or some variation thereof.
- donohoe 15y agoDid you know he invented RSS, and its the most relevant thing on the web today? You'd never guess. I met Dave a few times back when I was with the tImes though I doubt he remembers me. He's nice enough in person but he has his own personal reality distortion field. I had to stop following him in Google Reader and Twitter to stay sane.
- wyclif 15y agoThat "I invented RSS" line is utter bullshit of the highest order. Ramanathan V. Guha and Dan Libby of Netscape created it back in 1999. Do not pass go, do not drink the Kool-aid.
- wmf 15y agoOf course, Netscape's initial version of RSS sucked and didn't get much traction until Winer got involved. The history of RSS isn't a simple thing.
- wyclif 15y agoExcept I wasn't talking about traction or the simplicity of history, but the assertion that Winer "invented" RSS, which is patently false.
- deleted 15y ago[deleted]
- jacob_riis 15y agoCitation?
- joshu 15y agobtw Guha prefers to be called Guha...
- BrandonM 15y agoI'm pretty sure donohoe was being sarcastic. Maybe someday we'll learn that sarcasm is rarely an insightful addition to a discussion.
- donohoe 15y agoYes, I was being sarcastic in the first instance. I'm Irish, without sarcasm I'd have nothing.
- guan 15y agoDave Winer would agree with you: November 2010: http://scripting.com/stories/2010/11/11/didYouInventRss.html http://scripting.com/stories/2010/11/11/didYouInventRss.html January 2007: http://scripting.com/scripting2/davewiner/2007/01/02/rssWasntInvented.html http://scripting.com/scripting2/davewiner/2007/01/02/rssWasn... Here’s one characterization by someone else that he seems to approve of: “[RSS] grew out of a good idea in 1997 from the software company Userland that got picked up and melded with one of Netscape's similar ideas.” http://scripting.com/2003/04/14.html#lff229a9a0dde77eb6e47c1ba7712e790 http://scripting.com/2003/04/14.html#lff229a9a0dde77eb6e47c1... While you might still think that Dan Libby deserves more credit than Winer, this is a far cry from claiming that he invented RSS.
- deleted 15y ago[deleted]
- watmough 15y agoThis comment contributes nothing to the discussion. Dave's gone ahead and written a stand-out post that reflects upon bullying in general, and in tech in particular. Why not take the reasonable viewpoint that whilst we might not agree with everything RMS does or says, he deserves enormous respect for dedicating his life to a quest that has benefited most of us in one way or another.
- wyclif 15y agoActually, I'm kind of burned out on the "bullying" meme. But the point of my comment had nothing to do with RMS, it had to do with Dave's level of self-aggrandizement. That some people on HN buy the "I invented RSS" lie is visible upstream.
- danilocampos 15y agoI'm with you. Winer is exhausting because he spends so much time trying to make sure his reader understands how impressive he is. It gets dull.
- hvs 15y agoI find it disturbing that you thinking bullying is a "meme."
- ajscherer 15y agoI disagree. This comment supports Dave's argument about as well as any comment I could imagine reading.
- brlewis 15y agoDave is a good example for HN, where there's too much aversion to self-promotion. See also patio11's recent post touching on the value (or lack thereof) of modesty: http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3170766 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3170766 FYI, when you invoke "truth universally acknowledged", people familiar with that phrase's origin will expect it to be followed by a bad assumption. See http://www.paulgraham.com/iflisp.html http://www.paulgraham.com/iflisp.html
- raganwald 15y agoThis comment reminds me of bikeshedding. There was this whole post, full of emotion and anger and sadness and conflict, written about people and behaviour and social ostracism, and you climbed onto your soapbox to say THAT? I can’t help but feel that this is not your best work. I have no idea whether it’s true or not, but Dave’s personality is irrelevant to the argument, which is about online communities and cyber-bullying. Unless, perhaps, you are trying to demonstrate how it works? Have I failed to catch the subtle way you demonstrate that if someone is disliked for something, no matter what they say and how important it is, people will focus on why they dislike that person?
- michaelchisari 15y agoyou climbed onto your soapbox to say THAT? In Critical Theory discussions, it's called "derailing", and once you have a name for it, it becomes even more frustrating. Notice how now, we're not discussing the original ideas of the post, but are completely pushed into a tangential discussion. At least HN has threaded discussions. When it happens in flat discussions like Facebook, it's an order of magnitude more annoying.
- scott_s 15y agoSo, here's the problem I have: I agree with you. But I also had the same reaction the parent did. It's an irrational, unfair response, but I am so tired of reading Winer's writing that I find I'm not capable of considering his points. I even know this about myself, yet I still read the comments here, then I still read his post. Short version: yes it's unfair, but yes, in this case, I'm unable to separate the message from the messenger.
- raganwald 15y agoI empathize with you. While I read Dave’s words without trouble, I confess that I struggle with Eric Raymond’s words for reasons unrelated to the words themselves. It’s not easy for me to walk my talk, so I am loathe to criticize you for being just like me.
- 15y ago
- sull 15y agothe man routinely clarifies his involvements or lack thereof in the stuff that he is given credit for by others or by he himself. bottom line, he has been involved in important Internet endeavors and prior art. so you better believe that he will speak of it when applicable. i see faults in DW's personality and technical opinions and on occasion will point them out (as a nobody in his world). but i am completely willing to read his words and observe his works despite any of the shortcomings. i know my own faults and would hope that those faults would not deter other peoples willingness to read or listen to me when i have something to say.