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Boris Johnson is the only hope, in my opinion. Yeah he's a slimy, entitled, lying, racist, upper-class con-artist, but he's a populist at heart and has no princ

Boris Johnson is the only hope, in my opinion. Yeah he's a slimy, entitled, lying, racist, upper-class con-artist, but he's a populist at heart and has no principles beyond what he thinks will make the public like him. Yeah that's disgusting, and yeah it's the best of the worst, but it's still better than Cameronism, which simply doesn't care what you think. If an uproar comes, which it hopefully will, at least our fearless leader will listen, if only out of self-interest

toyg 4y ago
I hope that was satire...? Johnson is the one who keeps pushing these crazy schemes just to keep people riled up against the "bureaucracy-mad EU" he invented so many years ago. He will stop at nothing to stay in power, and will happily sacrifice all your freedoms to that effect - he doesn't respect the law anyway, so anything put on the book is just for you and me to be beaten down, not for him and his mates. > it's still better than Cameronism That's a false dichotomy. There is life outside the Tory ideological landscape. > If an uproar comes, which it hopefully will If the uproar comes from the "wrong" sector of the electorate, the Tories will just double down on it.
- permo-w 4y ago
  you're not really following the hn guide on commenting etiquette, and if you continue I won't reply any further. >That's a false dichotomy right now the options are Boris or a Cameronesque Tory. Sure in 2 years better options will be available, but that's in 2 years time. it is not a false dichotomy. besides, the longer Boris stays in power, the more he damages the Tories as a whole >If the uproar comes from the "wrong" sector of the electorate, the Tories will just double down on it this is an exaggeration, especially under the populism of Boris. yes they largely listen to their base, but they don't seek to actively antagonise others. they're a centre-right party that seeks a wide base without a high degree of polarisation. they're not the GOP or UKIP. given your comment, I suspect you may assert that they are more like the GOP or UKIP than I think. if so, I will agree to disagree on that it seems like you have a lot of emotion and anger about this, and that's fine, but I don't think it's helping your objectivity about actual outcomes and intentions. I also don't like him or his party, but in the short-term he's better than a right-wing ideologue that doesn't care what you think
  - toyg 4y ago
    I mean, you started with "Boris Johnson is our only hope", so I assumed HN etiquette was out of the window at that point. > 2 years better options will be available, but that's in 2 years time You assume the Tories can produce a majority after the current "Brexit coalition", held together by Johnson, collapses. That's not a given. It's also not a given that whichever cabinet a new PM could produce, will be strong enough to enact big policies. > but they don't seek to actively antagonise others. Policies like Rwanda deportations and the return of imperial measures are absolutely designed to produce outrage, and I challenge you to prove otherwise. The basic Johnson strategies are directly copied from the US playbook: they deliberately provoke the left in order to consolidate the right by defensive reaction, playing the victim and distracting from failures and scandals. And it works, for a while at least. Is the entire party like that? No, but the people who are, are currently running the show. > they're a centre-right party that seeks a wide base They were. They stopped being that when absolute power went to the likes of Reese-Mogg. They attracted radical Northern votes by acting extremist on issues where the Labour party refuses to do. This is not your dad's Tory party.
    - permo-w 4y ago
      First point, as far as I'm aware that phrasing has no relation to HN etiquette, and even if it does and you chose to interpret it in that worst possible sense, that doesn't give you the right to do it too Second point, do I assume that? I cannot see how you've read that from what I've said. I'm a dyed in the wool labour voter, and last I checked the Tories were down by about 15% in the polls. The rest is opinion that I disagree with. I'm not here to change your mind. It's fine to be emotional and shouty and take the worst possible view of everything, but I'm completely unconvinced by it, especially when you challenge me to prove a negative

toyg 4y ago

I hope that was satire...? Johnson is the one who keeps pushing these crazy schemes just to keep people riled up against the "bureaucracy-mad EU" he invented so many years ago. He will stop at nothing to stay in power, and will happily sacrifice all your freedoms to that effect - he doesn't respect the law anyway, so anything put on the book is just for you and me to be beaten down, not for him and his mates. > it's still better than Cameronism That's a false dichotomy. There is life outside the Tory ideological landscape. > If an uproar comes, which it hopefully will If the uproar comes from the "wrong" sector of the electorate, the Tories will just double down on it.

permo-w 4y ago
you're not really following the hn guide on commenting etiquette, and if you continue I won't reply any further. >That's a false dichotomy right now the options are Boris or a Cameronesque Tory. Sure in 2 years better options will be available, but that's in 2 years time. it is not a false dichotomy. besides, the longer Boris stays in power, the more he damages the Tories as a whole >If the uproar comes from the "wrong" sector of the electorate, the Tories will just double down on it this is an exaggeration, especially under the populism of Boris. yes they largely listen to their base, but they don't seek to actively antagonise others. they're a centre-right party that seeks a wide base without a high degree of polarisation. they're not the GOP or UKIP. given your comment, I suspect you may assert that they are more like the GOP or UKIP than I think. if so, I will agree to disagree on that it seems like you have a lot of emotion and anger about this, and that's fine, but I don't think it's helping your objectivity about actual outcomes and intentions. I also don't like him or his party, but in the short-term he's better than a right-wing ideologue that doesn't care what you think
- toyg 4y ago
  I mean, you started with "Boris Johnson is our only hope", so I assumed HN etiquette was out of the window at that point. > 2 years better options will be available, but that's in 2 years time You assume the Tories can produce a majority after the current "Brexit coalition", held together by Johnson, collapses. That's not a given. It's also not a given that whichever cabinet a new PM could produce, will be strong enough to enact big policies. > but they don't seek to actively antagonise others. Policies like Rwanda deportations and the return of imperial measures are absolutely designed to produce outrage, and I challenge you to prove otherwise. The basic Johnson strategies are directly copied from the US playbook: they deliberately provoke the left in order to consolidate the right by defensive reaction, playing the victim and distracting from failures and scandals. And it works, for a while at least. Is the entire party like that? No, but the people who are, are currently running the show. > they're a centre-right party that seeks a wide base They were. They stopped being that when absolute power went to the likes of Reese-Mogg. They attracted radical Northern votes by acting extremist on issues where the Labour party refuses to do. This is not your dad's Tory party.
  - permo-w 4y ago
    First point, as far as I'm aware that phrasing has no relation to HN etiquette, and even if it does and you chose to interpret it in that worst possible sense, that doesn't give you the right to do it too Second point, do I assume that? I cannot see how you've read that from what I've said. I'm a dyed in the wool labour voter, and last I checked the Tories were down by about 15% in the polls. The rest is opinion that I disagree with. I'm not here to change your mind. It's fine to be emotional and shouty and take the worst possible view of everything, but I'm completely unconvinced by it, especially when you challenge me to prove a negative