3 ms·

Of course there are, but it seems obvious to me that greater LGBTQ+ acceptance recently has led to people being more open with that side of themselves, rather t

Of course there are, but it seems obvious to me that greater LGBTQ+ acceptance recently has led to people being more open with that side of themselves, rather than it being the result of environmental pollution. Anyway, the alarm is very selective. I don't see people rapidly reducing their animal product consumption because of dioxin, a potent endocrine disruptor that is bioaccumulating. Atrazine is still used in most US corn production, are all the people concerned about plastic avoiding non-organic corn and corn products?

OJFord 4y ago
There's obvious correlation, but causation? And in particular that it would be obvious which way? I'm sure I'll regret this comment - I really don't have an axe to grind - I just don't find that 'obvious' at all (however real and fine the feeling itself).
dcow 4y ago
> Of course there are, but it seems obvious to me that greater LGBTQ+ acceptance recently has led to people being more open with that side of themselves, rather than it being the result of environmental pollution. Why does that seem obvious to you? Additionally, even if it's true, it may not be the only cause in rise of cases of gender dysphoria. Additionally additionally, it's also possible that some change in our environment has affected the prevalence of "LGBTQ+ acceptance" in the first place.
- yarg 4y ago
  The West's movement away from an Abrahamic worldview has certainly helped with the acceptability. There's no doubt that there's an aspect of the expectation of acceptance and safety that makes self-identification more viable (certainly more so than the expectation that your family is about to throw a bunch of rocks at you). However, that does not mean there's been no change in the underlying rates - it just means that the data is noisy. We've dealt with noisy data before.
  - dcow 4y ago
    I guess a more succinct way to phrase my question-point is: what if as western liberal humans we've always been accepting of anything as it increases in prevalence and something has cased the prevalence of LGBTQ+ to rise to a point where we naturally accept it more? Just a thought experiment I'm definitely not trying to question all the work activists have done. More-so opening the table and asking what if it's an effect and not a cause. I guess covid may be an obvious counter-example but meh.
    - yarg 4y ago
      If there's a shared cause to both it's industrialisation. It is the reason we're well fed and well educated - here's where I'd look for the cause of acceptance. It's also the beast we built to burn the world.
- tylerpipe 4y ago
  It seems that as more people start to absorb the ideology of gender identity that is being pushed upon society, some who wouldn't have otherwise considered it are applying these concepts to themselves. Hence the trend of people identifying as 'non-binary' in recent years - it's the logical conclusion of believing that 'man' and 'woman' refer to a collection of gendered stereotypes, rather than a description of one's sex.
  - samhyde69 4y ago

OJFord 4y ago

There's obvious correlation, but causation? And in particular that it would be obvious which way? I'm sure I'll regret this comment - I really don't have an axe to grind - I just don't find that 'obvious' at all (however real and fine the feeling itself).

dcow 4y ago

> Of course there are, but it seems obvious to me that greater LGBTQ+ acceptance recently has led to people being more open with that side of themselves, rather than it being the result of environmental pollution. Why does that seem obvious to you? Additionally, even if it's true, it may not be the only cause in rise of cases of gender dysphoria. Additionally additionally, it's also possible that some change in our environment has affected the prevalence of "LGBTQ+ acceptance" in the first place.

yarg 4y ago
The West's movement away from an Abrahamic worldview has certainly helped with the acceptability. There's no doubt that there's an aspect of the expectation of acceptance and safety that makes self-identification more viable (certainly more so than the expectation that your family is about to throw a bunch of rocks at you). However, that does not mean there's been no change in the underlying rates - it just means that the data is noisy. We've dealt with noisy data before.
- dcow 4y ago
  I guess a more succinct way to phrase my question-point is: what if as western liberal humans we've always been accepting of anything as it increases in prevalence and something has cased the prevalence of LGBTQ+ to rise to a point where we naturally accept it more? Just a thought experiment I'm definitely not trying to question all the work activists have done. More-so opening the table and asking what if it's an effect and not a cause. I guess covid may be an obvious counter-example but meh.
  - yarg 4y ago
    If there's a shared cause to both it's industrialisation. It is the reason we're well fed and well educated - here's where I'd look for the cause of acceptance. It's also the beast we built to burn the world.
tylerpipe 4y ago
It seems that as more people start to absorb the ideology of gender identity that is being pushed upon society, some who wouldn't have otherwise considered it are applying these concepts to themselves. Hence the trend of people identifying as 'non-binary' in recent years - it's the logical conclusion of believing that 'man' and 'woman' refer to a collection of gendered stereotypes, rather than a description of one's sex.
- samhyde69 4y ago