7 ms·

> "I'll never be able to succeed" Is it the condition which causes this, or the diagnosis of the condition? I think diagnoses can easily inspire feelings of f

> "I'll never be able to succeed" Is it the condition which causes this, or the diagnosis of the condition? I think diagnoses can easily inspire feelings of futility. It's no longer something you can change about yourself by wanting to change, it becomes a medical condition you've been stuck with.

dymk 4y ago
It's the condition that causes it. One of the diagnostic criteria for ADHD is anxiety over not being able to get things done. Your comment sounds dismissive of the real adverse impact of ADHD on one's inherent executive function; rather it's just someone being too "in their head" after they're giving a diagnosis. > it becomes a medical condition you've been stuck with 90-ish% of people with ADHD respond well to stimulants, and have complete remission of symptoms. And for those who don't respond well to stimulants, we have bupropion, etc. It's the one class of mental disorders where medication is very effective. For almost all with ADHD, it's not something you're "stuck" with.
- FollowingTheDao 4y ago
  "One of the diagnostic criteria for ADHD is anxiety over not being able to get things done." No, it is not. https://www.aafp.org/dam/AAFP/documents/patient_care/adhd_toolkit/adhd19-assessment-table1.pdf https://www.aafp.org/dam/AAFP/documents/patient_care/adhd_to... If you have to keep taking amphetamines you are stuck with it. It is clear that something dopamergenic is going on with these kids, but no one is trying to find out why they do not have enough dopamine. You know we have biological pathways that produce dopamine which are controlled by things in our environment. https://www.researchgate.net/figure/he-biosynthetic-pathway-of-dopamine-Tetrahydrobiopeterin-BH4-is-generated-from_fig1_243970581 https://www.researchgate.net/figure/he-biosynthetic-pathway-... Yeah, I said it, you can control ADHD by changing the environment. Zinc, B6, air pollution, protein intake, etc... Yet all we get is a pill? And you are all happy with that?
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
  - MaxDPS 4y ago
    I'm happy with the fact that medication has helped me immensely. That doesn't mean we should stop looking at better ways to address the issue, but until we find something better, i'll keep taking my meds.
user_7832 4y ago
It can be because the person will try to do things repeatedly, fail/be unsuccessful (due to executive dysfunction) and just feel shitty about their life overall. And by doing things it can even be "basic" stuff like laundry etc.
adastra22 4y ago
This hasn't been the case for anyone I know who has been diagnosed. For all of us it was immensely empowering: "Oh all that stuff I've been struggling with wasn't actually my fault? With this magic pill I can get stuff done too and not feel like an imposter all the time? Heck yea!" I can imagine what you saying applying to some childhood diagnoses. I cannot speak to anyone I know who was diagnosed in childhood thinking that way though.
falcolas 4y ago
The condition. It's abso-fucking-lutely the condition. Executive Dysfunction means you're screaming in your head to stand up and get work done, but your brain just keeps browsing hacker news. And not just monthly or weekly, but hourly. Sometimes even every few minutes. Diagnosed or undiagnosed.
- doliveira 4y ago
  I wonder if it's a "horoscope reading" kind of feeling, but I just identify so much with these descriptions of ADHD.
  - falcolas 4y ago
    Well, 5% of the population in general is the expected ratio of people with ADHD, but only 2% of the adult population is diagnosed with it, and it doesn't magically go away when you become an adult. So, there's definitely a chance. Two thoughts: - Everyone will occasionally exhibit some ADHD symptoms, the question is how often. Monthly? Probably not a problem. Hourly, or every few minutes? Probably is a problem. - See a professional. Self diagnosis can't get you the help you need.
    - doliveira 4y ago
      Yeah, mine have persisted all day along for as long as I can remember... I guess I'm not the stereotypical hyperactive, but when it comes to the attention span it does fit me a glove. I should probably get it checked. Thing is I'm afraid of "faking it", if it makes any sense?
      - LocalPCGuy 4y ago
        I'd personally recommend to go get checked. The evaluation I went through was like 6 hours long (I know, getting checked for ADHD and they want 6 hours of testing?! Seriously.) But it is to rule out other issues, other conditions and to ensure that the results are correct. In fact, they even adjust for "faking it" in the tests (not that someone couldn't do it, but they are looking for common patterns that would indicate someone try to sway the tests). I'm definitely not, as you put it, the stereotypical "hyperactive", but on learning more, I realized how many little tics I have that I do but in very masked ways so as to not draw attention. But that aside, there is 3 different diagnosis for ADHD - primary hyperactive, primary-inattentive or combination (both to some level). Despite what I said about tics, my diagnosis was for the inattentive side of things. "Head in the clouds", "daydreamer", etc. It's all relatively new for me, it wasn't something I really seriously considered until a year or two ago (and I'm in my 40s now), despite having a brother who was medicated fairly young and a father who displays many of the same traits (never diagnosed though). It's definitely helped me to know this, puts some puzzle pieces in place, so to speak, and gives me a path forward toward managing something I didn't really realize I needed to manage, but was having a significant impact on my life regardless.
BoorishBears 4y ago
A lot of people who get diagnosed are diagnosed without anything near a full understanding of what it is, especially when diagnosed at a young age, so I don't buy this hypothesis. As I kid I didn't have any inkling of what aspects of my personality and/or abilities were related to ADHD, and most people I've met who were diagnosed young have been in the same bucket. If anything being diagnosed should help stave off depression since ADHD tends to mimic a mentality most people just refer to as "lazy". You don't have "executive function disorder", you just fixate on things you like and ignore stuff you don't. You don't have ADHD, you're just messy and disorganized. Futility comes with a lack of understanding when it comes to this disease.
thomastjeffery 4y ago
As a 28 year old who was just diagnosed, I can tell you from lived experience that it's the condition, and by extension, the expectations that people have of you that you aren't capable of meeting. When I was a kid, I constantly described myself as "lazy" and "tired". Now I understand I was really experiencing "executive disfunction" and "understimulation". Adding those words to my vocabulary didn't cure my ADHD, but it did relieve some internalized shame and anxiety that were caused by living undiagnosed (and therefore untreated).
Avamander 4y ago
It's the condition. You can try place your hand on a glowing hot stove. Couldn't? Imagine that with every task, however willing or not you are. Some have it better, some worse. Just one side of the disorder already being a big hindrance.
- falcolas 4y ago
  Fantastic analogy, because that hesitation is something everybody can relate to. All that's missing is how there's no consequence underlying that hesitation; how you can't justify why you can't do the task.
andybak 4y ago
A diagnosis had completely the opposite effect for me. I stopped blaming my own failings and could compartmentalize those aspects of my life that were holding me back as something external that wasn't my "fault". The result was a big reduction in guilt and a big increase in happiness and productivity.
lucasmullens 4y ago
When I got diagnosed with ADHD I felt empowered. It let me think, no, I'm not uniquely broken, there's a ton of successful people who have similar brain chemistry to me. I think you're getting downvoted because it sounds like you're encouraging people not to get professional help.
PartiallyTyped 4y ago
Anecdata: I never considered the case that I have adhd until I chatted with a friend who was diagnosed with it and our experiences and patterns of behaviour were alike. I'd go as far as to argue that a diagnosis opens the door to solutions even non medical ones.
zemoose 4y ago
Annecdotally? The condition. It was actually the opposite of what you described. Getting diagnosed in early adulthood was actually a huge weight off my shoulders, because I suddenly understood why I was struggling and had a path forward for seeking treatment. Prior to that, I was just drowning and overwhelmed, and I didn't know why. It felt like nothing I did helped and I wasn't making any progress towards my goals. I felt like I was barely a functional adult. It felt terrible.
galoisgirl 4y ago
I've had these thoughts as a teenager but got diagnosed at 32. > it becomes a medical condition you've been stuck with. It can feel like this. However, for me, it was much more of a "finally, an explanation!". It showed me my limits are a bit lower than I hoped for, but it gave me immense clarity about those limits. Plus finding your limits, realising there are things you'll never achieve... I think that's anyone's fate sooner or later. It's okay.

dymk 4y ago

It's the condition that causes it. One of the diagnostic criteria for ADHD is anxiety over not being able to get things done. Your comment sounds dismissive of the real adverse impact of ADHD on one's inherent executive function; rather it's just someone being too "in their head" after they're giving a diagnosis. > it becomes a medical condition you've been stuck with 90-ish% of people with ADHD respond well to stimulants, and have complete remission of symptoms. And for those who don't respond well to stimulants, we have bupropion, etc. It's the one class of mental disorders where medication is very effective. For almost all with ADHD, it's not something you're "stuck" with.

FollowingTheDao 4y ago
"One of the diagnostic criteria for ADHD is anxiety over not being able to get things done." No, it is not. https://www.aafp.org/dam/AAFP/documents/patient_care/adhd_toolkit/adhd19-assessment-table1.pdf https://www.aafp.org/dam/AAFP/documents/patient_care/adhd_to... If you have to keep taking amphetamines you are stuck with it. It is clear that something dopamergenic is going on with these kids, but no one is trying to find out why they do not have enough dopamine. You know we have biological pathways that produce dopamine which are controlled by things in our environment. https://www.researchgate.net/figure/he-biosynthetic-pathway-of-dopamine-Tetrahydrobiopeterin-BH4-is-generated-from_fig1_243970581 https://www.researchgate.net/figure/he-biosynthetic-pathway-... Yeah, I said it, you can control ADHD by changing the environment. Zinc, B6, air pollution, protein intake, etc... Yet all we get is a pill? And you are all happy with that?
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- MaxDPS 4y ago
  I'm happy with the fact that medication has helped me immensely. That doesn't mean we should stop looking at better ways to address the issue, but until we find something better, i'll keep taking my meds.

user_7832 4y ago

It can be because the person will try to do things repeatedly, fail/be unsuccessful (due to executive dysfunction) and just feel shitty about their life overall. And by doing things it can even be "basic" stuff like laundry etc.

adastra22 4y ago

This hasn't been the case for anyone I know who has been diagnosed. For all of us it was immensely empowering: "Oh all that stuff I've been struggling with wasn't actually my fault? With this magic pill I can get stuff done too and not feel like an imposter all the time? Heck yea!" I can imagine what you saying applying to some childhood diagnoses. I cannot speak to anyone I know who was diagnosed in childhood thinking that way though.

falcolas 4y ago

The condition. It's abso-fucking-lutely the condition. Executive Dysfunction means you're screaming in your head to stand up and get work done, but your brain just keeps browsing hacker news. And not just monthly or weekly, but hourly. Sometimes even every few minutes. Diagnosed or undiagnosed.

doliveira 4y ago
I wonder if it's a "horoscope reading" kind of feeling, but I just identify so much with these descriptions of ADHD.
- falcolas 4y ago
  Well, 5% of the population in general is the expected ratio of people with ADHD, but only 2% of the adult population is diagnosed with it, and it doesn't magically go away when you become an adult. So, there's definitely a chance. Two thoughts: - Everyone will occasionally exhibit some ADHD symptoms, the question is how often. Monthly? Probably not a problem. Hourly, or every few minutes? Probably is a problem. - See a professional. Self diagnosis can't get you the help you need.
  - doliveira 4y ago
    Yeah, mine have persisted all day along for as long as I can remember... I guess I'm not the stereotypical hyperactive, but when it comes to the attention span it does fit me a glove. I should probably get it checked. Thing is I'm afraid of "faking it", if it makes any sense?
    - LocalPCGuy 4y ago
      I'd personally recommend to go get checked. The evaluation I went through was like 6 hours long (I know, getting checked for ADHD and they want 6 hours of testing?! Seriously.) But it is to rule out other issues, other conditions and to ensure that the results are correct. In fact, they even adjust for "faking it" in the tests (not that someone couldn't do it, but they are looking for common patterns that would indicate someone try to sway the tests). I'm definitely not, as you put it, the stereotypical "hyperactive", but on learning more, I realized how many little tics I have that I do but in very masked ways so as to not draw attention. But that aside, there is 3 different diagnosis for ADHD - primary hyperactive, primary-inattentive or combination (both to some level). Despite what I said about tics, my diagnosis was for the inattentive side of things. "Head in the clouds", "daydreamer", etc. It's all relatively new for me, it wasn't something I really seriously considered until a year or two ago (and I'm in my 40s now), despite having a brother who was medicated fairly young and a father who displays many of the same traits (never diagnosed though). It's definitely helped me to know this, puts some puzzle pieces in place, so to speak, and gives me a path forward toward managing something I didn't really realize I needed to manage, but was having a significant impact on my life regardless.

BoorishBears 4y ago

A lot of people who get diagnosed are diagnosed without anything near a full understanding of what it is, especially when diagnosed at a young age, so I don't buy this hypothesis. As I kid I didn't have any inkling of what aspects of my personality and/or abilities were related to ADHD, and most people I've met who were diagnosed young have been in the same bucket. If anything being diagnosed should help stave off depression since ADHD tends to mimic a mentality most people just refer to as "lazy". You don't have "executive function disorder", you just fixate on things you like and ignore stuff you don't. You don't have ADHD, you're just messy and disorganized. Futility comes with a lack of understanding when it comes to this disease.

thomastjeffery 4y ago

As a 28 year old who was just diagnosed, I can tell you from lived experience that it's the condition, and by extension, the expectations that people have of you that you aren't capable of meeting. When I was a kid, I constantly described myself as "lazy" and "tired". Now I understand I was really experiencing "executive disfunction" and "understimulation". Adding those words to my vocabulary didn't cure my ADHD, but it did relieve some internalized shame and anxiety that were caused by living undiagnosed (and therefore untreated).

Avamander 4y ago

It's the condition. You can try place your hand on a glowing hot stove. Couldn't? Imagine that with every task, however willing or not you are. Some have it better, some worse. Just one side of the disorder already being a big hindrance.

falcolas 4y ago
Fantastic analogy, because that hesitation is something everybody can relate to. All that's missing is how there's no consequence underlying that hesitation; how you can't justify why you can't do the task.

andybak 4y ago

A diagnosis had completely the opposite effect for me. I stopped blaming my own failings and could compartmentalize those aspects of my life that were holding me back as something external that wasn't my "fault". The result was a big reduction in guilt and a big increase in happiness and productivity.

lucasmullens 4y ago

When I got diagnosed with ADHD I felt empowered. It let me think, no, I'm not uniquely broken, there's a ton of successful people who have similar brain chemistry to me. I think you're getting downvoted because it sounds like you're encouraging people not to get professional help.

PartiallyTyped 4y ago

Anecdata: I never considered the case that I have adhd until I chatted with a friend who was diagnosed with it and our experiences and patterns of behaviour were alike. I'd go as far as to argue that a diagnosis opens the door to solutions even non medical ones.

zemoose 4y ago

Annecdotally? The condition. It was actually the opposite of what you described. Getting diagnosed in early adulthood was actually a huge weight off my shoulders, because I suddenly understood why I was struggling and had a path forward for seeking treatment. Prior to that, I was just drowning and overwhelmed, and I didn't know why. It felt like nothing I did helped and I wasn't making any progress towards my goals. I felt like I was barely a functional adult. It felt terrible.

galoisgirl 4y ago

I've had these thoughts as a teenager but got diagnosed at 32. > it becomes a medical condition you've been stuck with. It can feel like this. However, for me, it was much more of a "finally, an explanation!". It showed me my limits are a bit lower than I hoped for, but it gave me immense clarity about those limits. Plus finding your limits, realising there are things you'll never achieve... I think that's anyone's fate sooner or later. It's okay.