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22kwh is 90 amps at 230 volts. Surprised is 20k to install a single one of these. In the us most newer homes have 200+ amps of service providing 48kw of peak e

22kwh is 90 amps at 230 volts. Surprised is 20k to install a single one of these. In the us most newer homes have 200+ amps of service providing 48kw of peak electric capacity.

WatchDog 4y ago
Aren't US homes running at 120 volts? 22kw at 230 volts would be ~95 amps. 22kw at 120 volts would be ~183 amps. 48kw at 120 volts would be 400 amps.
- proto_lambda 4y ago
  No, US homes are typically 240V split-phase: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Split-phase_electric_power https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Split-phase_electric_power
- goodcanadian 4y ago
  Aren't US homes running at 120 volts? Yes . . . and no. In North America, homes are actually supplied with 240V. A split-phase system with a centre-tap transformer is then used to create two 120V "phases." So, your typical outlets will be on one of two 120V phases. However, there are usually a couple of 240V outlets as well for things like electric stoves, and clothes dryers. So, in short, single phase 240V is available in essentially every U.S. household. The cars, themselves, usually require 3-phase 240V to do 22kW. You are highly unlikely to have access to that in a U.S. home.
kuon 4y ago
no, 22kW is 32A as we use three 240V (to neutral, so around 400V between phases) phases here. Most home here have 40A capacity (mine does). You have to pay for the introduction box, which need to be changed in my case and is about 7000$ [1] and you have to may for each extra A capacity, which is 150$ per A. So 32*150 is 4800 + 7000. And that's only to change the capacity of what we call the "introduction". Then I have to change the cabling inside the house up to the breaker room and install a charging station. The whole thing is about 20k [1]: https://www.romande-energie.ch/images/files/conditions/2021-re-prix.pdf https://www.romande-energie.ch/images/files/conditions/2021-...
- jnsaff2 4y ago
  I don't get what you are saying. You have 3x40A. Your biggest user is occasional 3x25A. So you have 3x15A available almost all the time. 3x16A is 11kW, you can tell your car or charger to go no more than 3x13A or 3x10A or whatever, this can even be automated by most charging stations. When you have your local EV meetup with 3 cars and all want to charge then either take turns or have all charge at 3x13 each and switch the heating off for that time. I have this at home [0]. It plugs into a regular (red) 3x16A socket, has RCD protection built in and needs 0 installation cost and no nonsense about utility needing to come and do anything. Surely you have one of those red 3x16A or 3x32A sockets in your garage/workshop wherever? If not your local electrician can put it in for xx instead of utility doing something unneeded for xxxx or xxxxx. [0] - https://eauto.si/metron-shop/product/pc05t-3x16a-3-phase/ https://eauto.si/metron-shop/product/pc05t-3x16a-3-phase/
  - kuon 4y ago
    As I said I am at the limit already, I have my home lab and a small server farm for work, I also have a workshop. I already cannot put everything on, if I use the workshop, you cannot use the kitchen oven for example. I realize 11kW is enough for most usage, but in my case, even that requires changing infrastructure, which is expensive.
    - jnsaff2 4y ago
      Most chargers have Dynamic Load Management readyness where they have a Modbus power meter at your main circuit breaker and makes sure the charger only uses available power. So you can switch on your oven and car will automatically back off. For this kind of consumption tho I would consider installing solar panels if that is possible/feasible.
      - koide 4y ago
        I have an 11A charger and some 5kW solar panel setup, and I am lucky enough that I'm able to charge during the day the trips I make early in the morning just with solar.

22kwh is 90 amps at 230 volts. Surprised is 20k to install a single one of these. In the us most newer homes have 200+ amps of service providing 48kw of peak electric capacity.

WatchDog 4y ago

Aren't US homes running at 120 volts? 22kw at 230 volts would be ~95 amps. 22kw at 120 volts would be ~183 amps. 48kw at 120 volts would be 400 amps.

proto_lambda 4y ago
No, US homes are typically 240V split-phase: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Split-phase_electric_power https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Split-phase_electric_power
goodcanadian 4y ago
Aren't US homes running at 120 volts? Yes . . . and no. In North America, homes are actually supplied with 240V. A split-phase system with a centre-tap transformer is then used to create two 120V "phases." So, your typical outlets will be on one of two 120V phases. However, there are usually a couple of 240V outlets as well for things like electric stoves, and clothes dryers. So, in short, single phase 240V is available in essentially every U.S. household. The cars, themselves, usually require 3-phase 240V to do 22kW. You are highly unlikely to have access to that in a U.S. home.

kuon 4y ago

no, 22kW is 32A as we use three 240V (to neutral, so around 400V between phases) phases here. Most home here have 40A capacity (mine does). You have to pay for the introduction box, which need to be changed in my case and is about 7000$ [1] and you have to may for each extra A capacity, which is 150$ per A. So 32*150 is 4800 + 7000. And that's only to change the capacity of what we call the "introduction". Then I have to change the cabling inside the house up to the breaker room and install a charging station. The whole thing is about 20k [1]: https://www.romande-energie.ch/images/files/conditions/2021-re-prix.pdf https://www.romande-energie.ch/images/files/conditions/2021-...

jnsaff2 4y ago
I don't get what you are saying. You have 3x40A. Your biggest user is occasional 3x25A. So you have 3x15A available almost all the time. 3x16A is 11kW, you can tell your car or charger to go no more than 3x13A or 3x10A or whatever, this can even be automated by most charging stations. When you have your local EV meetup with 3 cars and all want to charge then either take turns or have all charge at 3x13 each and switch the heating off for that time. I have this at home [0]. It plugs into a regular (red) 3x16A socket, has RCD protection built in and needs 0 installation cost and no nonsense about utility needing to come and do anything. Surely you have one of those red 3x16A or 3x32A sockets in your garage/workshop wherever? If not your local electrician can put it in for xx instead of utility doing something unneeded for xxxx or xxxxx. [0] - https://eauto.si/metron-shop/product/pc05t-3x16a-3-phase/ https://eauto.si/metron-shop/product/pc05t-3x16a-3-phase/
- kuon 4y ago
  As I said I am at the limit already, I have my home lab and a small server farm for work, I also have a workshop. I already cannot put everything on, if I use the workshop, you cannot use the kitchen oven for example. I realize 11kW is enough for most usage, but in my case, even that requires changing infrastructure, which is expensive.
  - jnsaff2 4y ago
    Most chargers have Dynamic Load Management readyness where they have a Modbus power meter at your main circuit breaker and makes sure the charger only uses available power. So you can switch on your oven and car will automatically back off. For this kind of consumption tho I would consider installing solar panels if that is possible/feasible.
    - koide 4y ago
      I have an 11A charger and some 5kW solar panel setup, and I am lucky enough that I'm able to charge during the day the trips I make early in the morning just with solar.