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Our entire justice system exists "as a way to get away from outrage" and we're better off for it. Angry mobs don't produce good outcomes. That's true even when

by dolni 4y ago

Our entire justice system exists "as a way to get away from outrage" and we're better off for it. Angry mobs don't produce good outcomes. That's true even when they're angry about bad cops.

Spivak 4y ago
Angry mobs are a signal of our justice system either having a gap or otherwise not working. The whole point of having a justice system at all is to transform mob rule into a dialog so when mobs form it’s usually because justice isn’t being served. You don’t see people showing up at a murderer’s house with pitchforks or workers breaking down the doors of factory owners because we have laws that (roughly) enforce the outcomes the people want. Angry mobs produce fantastic outcomes at identifying when the justice system’s outcomes fall outside of the norms they’re supposed to be enforcing but they’re terrible at functioning as judge and jury in individual cases.
- b112 4y ago
  Angry mobs are a signal of our justice system either having a gap or otherwise not working. Lately, most angry mobs start on twitter/facebook, and often are based upon exaggerations or lies, and have the aide of twitter/facebook amplification effects, which purposefully try to fan anger to drive more engagement.
- fleddr 4y ago
  "Angry mobs are a signal of our justice system either having a gap or otherwise not working" Or...radicalized always-online bullies that simply takes joy in taking a political opponent down.
- andrewflnr 4y ago
  Angry mobs are a signal of humans being stupid pack animals. It's sheer luck if they coalesce around a good cause.
  - somat 4y ago
    My threshold for whether a mob is legitimate is looting, I have no tolerance for your cause if your mob starts looting. Note however that police stations and capital buildings are a fair target.
    - andrewflnr 4y ago
      So Twitter mobs are 100% legitimate as they have no opportunity to loot, but you make no allowance for mobs of mixed idealists and opportunists, or for attacking critical infrastructure? Fascinating.
      - somat 4y ago
        If your twitter mob stays on twitter, that is free speech, stupid, but that is your right to be stupid. when your twitter mob starts to take action(swatting, doxing, physical attack) is when it starts to matter. First note that mobs are ugly stupid irrational things in the first place. Now ask your self. agree or disagree with the message, who is this mob attacking are they attacking their enemies? if so this is a legitimize mob, they have goals, objectives and are acting on them. you may be on the other side, they may be your enemy but the attacks are valid. leave the fight to them and the people they are attacking, or take a side. however if the mob is targeting civilians, random people, causing willful destruction for the sake of destruction, that is, are they looting? This is an illegitimate mob, their message has no value, they have no right to exist and should be actively suppressed by all.
deanCommie 4y ago
Not every dispute in our society involves the justice system. Far from it. Especially inside private companies. But when it comes to police, the problem is even worse. The justice system there is charged with enforcing itself, and the conflict of interest is apparent. Dealing with police brutality is no different than dealing with bullying or harassment at work - it usually involves some form of "internal affairs" or "human resources", whose primary job is to minimize damage to the company, not bring justice to the aggrieved party.
sobkas 4y ago
Angry mob doesn't work in case of bad cops(and many more) because it's not that angry and definitely not that big. And there is also a very happy mob that is happy about bad cops and think they work as intended. Because sacrificing few people from minority groups is a price they are wiling to pay for their safety. Because upholding status quo is something people are willing other people to die for.

by dolni 4y ago

Our entire justice system exists "as a way to get away from outrage" and we're better off for it. Angry mobs don't produce good outcomes. That's true even when they're angry about bad cops.

Spivak 4y ago

Angry mobs are a signal of our justice system either having a gap or otherwise not working. The whole point of having a justice system at all is to transform mob rule into a dialog so when mobs form it’s usually because justice isn’t being served. You don’t see people showing up at a murderer’s house with pitchforks or workers breaking down the doors of factory owners because we have laws that (roughly) enforce the outcomes the people want. Angry mobs produce fantastic outcomes at identifying when the justice system’s outcomes fall outside of the norms they’re supposed to be enforcing but they’re terrible at functioning as judge and jury in individual cases.

b112 4y ago
Angry mobs are a signal of our justice system either having a gap or otherwise not working. Lately, most angry mobs start on twitter/facebook, and often are based upon exaggerations or lies, and have the aide of twitter/facebook amplification effects, which purposefully try to fan anger to drive more engagement.
fleddr 4y ago
"Angry mobs are a signal of our justice system either having a gap or otherwise not working" Or...radicalized always-online bullies that simply takes joy in taking a political opponent down.
andrewflnr 4y ago
Angry mobs are a signal of humans being stupid pack animals. It's sheer luck if they coalesce around a good cause.
- somat 4y ago
  My threshold for whether a mob is legitimate is looting, I have no tolerance for your cause if your mob starts looting. Note however that police stations and capital buildings are a fair target.
  - andrewflnr 4y ago
    So Twitter mobs are 100% legitimate as they have no opportunity to loot, but you make no allowance for mobs of mixed idealists and opportunists, or for attacking critical infrastructure? Fascinating.
    - somat 4y ago
      If your twitter mob stays on twitter, that is free speech, stupid, but that is your right to be stupid. when your twitter mob starts to take action(swatting, doxing, physical attack) is when it starts to matter. First note that mobs are ugly stupid irrational things in the first place. Now ask your self. agree or disagree with the message, who is this mob attacking are they attacking their enemies? if so this is a legitimize mob, they have goals, objectives and are acting on them. you may be on the other side, they may be your enemy but the attacks are valid. leave the fight to them and the people they are attacking, or take a side. however if the mob is targeting civilians, random people, causing willful destruction for the sake of destruction, that is, are they looting? This is an illegitimate mob, their message has no value, they have no right to exist and should be actively suppressed by all.

deanCommie 4y ago

Not every dispute in our society involves the justice system. Far from it. Especially inside private companies. But when it comes to police, the problem is even worse. The justice system there is charged with enforcing itself, and the conflict of interest is apparent. Dealing with police brutality is no different than dealing with bullying or harassment at work - it usually involves some form of "internal affairs" or "human resources", whose primary job is to minimize damage to the company, not bring justice to the aggrieved party.

sobkas 4y ago

Angry mob doesn't work in case of bad cops(and many more) because it's not that angry and definitely not that big. And there is also a very happy mob that is happy about bad cops and think they work as intended. Because sacrificing few people from minority groups is a price they are wiling to pay for their safety. Because upholding status quo is something people are willing other people to die for.