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You have a really good point, thank you for your post and the reminder of this aspect! I believe fully in the importance of ethics and security that we as a so

You have a really good point, thank you for your post and the reminder of this aspect! I believe fully in the importance of ethics and security that we as a society and we that work in tech should be honoring in full. It is disheartening to watch trusted companies utilize that -just enough- mentality to skim over the tops of audits. We have all seen what it looks like when companies operate from the absolute minimum and how dangerous and disrespectful that is for everyone- company and users included.

pc86 4y ago
> It is disheartening to watch trusted companies utilize that -just enough- mentality to skim over the tops of audits. I'll be honest, this mentality bothers me. The point of independent audits and guidelines is to tell someone what the minimum bar is. If the minimum is 50, and the company goes from 20 to 50 in order to pass that audit, that's a good thing, not "doing just enough...to skim over the top." If you want to argue the minimum should be 75 instead, fine, but argue that the audit isn't good enough or that the guidelines are wrong, not that the companies are somehow unethical or immoral for spending more money than they need to in order to pass a vendor security review that is not going to award them any extra credit for effort.
- FeaturelessBug 4y ago
  The point is exactly that- morality isn't for "extra credit", we shouldn't need to get rewarded to do the right thing- that's kind of the point. I mean sure, maybe when it comes to smaller companies. But some of the companies with the biggest security blunders are those that have enough money that the security for their users information should be a major priority and those costs would barely impact their bottom line. And also... Using this same train of argument couldn't we also just argue that the cost of security compliance shouldn't be this high to begin with so it's more accessible?
  - pc86 4y ago
    Isn't that supposed to be the whole point of these security reviews? To tell people where the line is? Saying "just do more because it's the moral thing to do" is not a convincing argument, because it doesn't tell anyone what "more" is.
- ab_testing 4y ago
  Exactly, if you want me to wear 37 pieces of flair, why don't you just make the minimum 37 pieces of flair?

pc86 4y ago

> It is disheartening to watch trusted companies utilize that -just enough- mentality to skim over the tops of audits. I'll be honest, this mentality bothers me. The point of independent audits and guidelines is to tell someone what the minimum bar is. If the minimum is 50, and the company goes from 20 to 50 in order to pass that audit, that's a good thing, not "doing just enough...to skim over the top." If you want to argue the minimum should be 75 instead, fine, but argue that the audit isn't good enough or that the guidelines are wrong, not that the companies are somehow unethical or immoral for spending more money than they need to in order to pass a vendor security review that is not going to award them any extra credit for effort.

FeaturelessBug 4y ago
The point is exactly that- morality isn't for "extra credit", we shouldn't need to get rewarded to do the right thing- that's kind of the point. I mean sure, maybe when it comes to smaller companies. But some of the companies with the biggest security blunders are those that have enough money that the security for their users information should be a major priority and those costs would barely impact their bottom line. And also... Using this same train of argument couldn't we also just argue that the cost of security compliance shouldn't be this high to begin with so it's more accessible?
- pc86 4y ago
  Isn't that supposed to be the whole point of these security reviews? To tell people where the line is? Saying "just do more because it's the moral thing to do" is not a convincing argument, because it doesn't tell anyone what "more" is.
ab_testing 4y ago
Exactly, if you want me to wear 37 pieces of flair, why don't you just make the minimum 37 pieces of flair?