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Aleph.js – Fullstack Framework in Deno
- 0des 4y ago> WE ARE CURRENTLY REWRITING THIS FRAMEWORK, MANY THINGS ARE STILL SUBJECT TO CHANGE AT ANY TIME. Noticing a pattern here with deno projects.
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- waatels 4y agoWell deno is about five years old. That is to be expected, isn't it ? The timing feel similar to rust to me. It needed almost a decade to have real production ready project. Mozilla was an exception as they built it.
- 0des 4y agoMaybe I'm spoiled, which I'm willing to consider being true. However, one could assume that projects at this stage would use versioning, pinning, and documenting the changes to the api, which obviate the need for these types of disclaimers. All caps disclaimers like this could discourage those who are otherwise capable from giving it a shot. Im not saying this is deno's fault, maybe it is and maybe it isn't, I'm only saying I'm noticing that rather than documenting through breaking changes people would prefer to make prominent disclaimers that are essentially buyer beware
- tuxie_ 4y agoI'm currently developing an "experimental" piece of software, i.e. I am not even sure some features I want to add are possible, meaning I had to rewrite it a couple of times (and won't be the last). Having strict versioning, pinning, and documenting everything before it reaches a semi-stable state would discourage me from developing it altogether. I agree with the approach they are taking, keep the disclaimer, put it out there, get some visibility to find early adopters and contributors and stabilize it. A year from now people will have forgotten about this thread and will see it a new and stable framework.
- schwartzworld 4y agoI think if you look at Angular as an example, the Aleph team is doing it right. Angular didn't just make breaking changes when they went 2.0, they basically abandoned everything about 1.x and released something completely new. There were definitely people who had just learned Angular 1 that found out their time was poorly spent.
- nindalf 4y agoThat doesn’t sound right to me. Rust 1.0 released in 2015. Facebook had a source control server in production in 2018. Does that count as “real”?
- dgb23 4y agoDeno 1.0 is roughly two years old. It's also apples to oranges. Deno is a JS runtime plus a std library. Aleph is still an experimental web framework. If you want to make a more apt comparison look at the web framework/library stuff in Rust that has frontend affordances/capabilities, which has a similarly immature v0.X feel to it.
- bryanrasmussen 4y agoHow many years before a language is mature enough that it's not to be expected? I'm thinking 5 years is starting to push it, but others may have other opinions. on edit: when saying push it I mean sort of still reasonable, but maybe a bit troubling? 7 years would definitely feel like too much to me. I wonder if there are any studies.
- lenkite 4y agoDeno 1.0 is actually only 2 years and not 5 years.
- bryanrasmussen 4y agoOk, but obviously when I say 5 years I mean from the start of development of the language not from when it is given 1.0 status. Is it your contention that the count to 5 years should start from when language creators say it is at 1.0 - if so I think 5 years is way over the line for when people should be saying they are rewriting projects written in it from the bottom up periodically.
- lenkite 4y agoStart of development could be a "hello world" commit, so I would say any critical judgements should always be from the 1.0 release. Far too much churn before then anyways. Rust changed a truckload.
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- burk96 4y agoAm I missing something? Or is there no actual documentation for its current incarnation? Clicking the link and then following the link for documentation is an infinite loop.
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- bzxcvbn 4y agoWhat is "fullstack framework" supposed to mean? "It can do everything"?
- sierkov 4y agoIt just means "I handle front and back end" and it's all typescript.
- quickthrower2 4y agoProbably can do both the server and client side.
- bzxcvbn 4y agoYes, but what it does mean? What are the actual capabilities? There are no docs.
- quickthrower2 4y agoI couldn’t find docs either I reckon this has been posted here a bit too early
- sscarduzio 4y agoThe only thing I ask to Deno is to make typescript development as immediate as running python. I'm exhausted by webpack and similar
- samhuk 4y agoUse esbuild to transpile and bundle your typescript. It's 10-100x times faster. The only issue is that esbuild only removes the type-only part of typescript, and doesn't do the type-checking part.
- lucacasonato 4y agoIt is. Deno runs TypeScript out of the box.
- abdusco 4y agoIt strips type info and runs it as Javascript, though. There's no native typescript runtime, AFAIK (it doesn't enforce types at runtime, only at build time)
- djxfade 4y agoThere is no such thing as a TypeScript runtime. TypeScript has always been a static typechecker
- rtpg 4y agoPeople say this all the time. What does “enforced type system” mean to you? To my knowledge there is no language with a system that adds type checks (except in the case of checking a cast inside of a nominal type system). Casts are such a tiny slice of code, and you can choose to not use them! It adds tedium, but none that would be missing in other languages.
- croes 4y agoYou do realize deno is based on the V8 JavaScript Engine and there isn't such thing as a typescript runtime even by Microsoft the developers of typescript? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TypeScript https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TypeScript
- HasanYousef 4y agoNew web framework, why?
- swyx 4y agothis framework with 4.2k github stars appears not to have any docs at all (i went to alephjs.org and it just redirects to the github repo). am i missing something?
- searchableguy 4y agoThey removed the docs for the older version of the framework which was used by many people (hence the stars).
- agluszak 4y agoIs it related in any way to Fresh? https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31720110 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31720110
- norman784 4y agoThey are different projects, Aleph is more or less the Next.js for Deno. Also AFAIK Fresh uses a different architecture, where it can compile your app as micro frontends or island architecture if you like, you can check out Astro[0] to understand better this architecture. [0] https://astro.build https://astro.build
- johnmorrison 4y agoThis looks great! Checked out some of the example apps and the code looks really clean compared to other frameworks I've recently used, and I love the elegance of the export const $VERB ... structure of the server route files.
- amsterdorn 4y agoShould at least have some documentation to read before sharing. There's no info about what this does/how to use it on the repo or the site.