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There is nothing politically or scientifically incorrect about saying that parents who educate their kids raise more successful children. It is both scientific

There is nothing politically or scientifically incorrect about saying that parents who educate their kids raise more successful children. It is both scientifically and politically incorrect to say that parenting doesn't matter, only the color of the child's skin. It is just all around incorrect to say that groups of people raise worse kids intentionally due to culture. Children raised by uneducated parents surrounded by crime are worse off due to their environment, and their culture is a product of that environment. It is only by the collective will of society (e.g., promoting enlightenment ideals over the objections of the superstitious masses, which happened longer ago in some places vs. others by political chance) that this changes. It is politically incorrect to blame people who are in these situations instead of bringing about the change to fix it.

lelanthran 4y ago
> It is both scientifically and politically incorrect to say that parenting doesn't matter, only the color of the child's skin. Who said that? Looks and sounds like a strawman, otherwise why are you responding to a race-based argument that was never made? > It is politically incorrect to blame people who are in these situations instead of bringing about the change to fix it. Once again, who actually did that? Another strawman? A culture that normalises or encourages single parents over the alternatives results in worse outcomes for those kids. It's an inferior culture. A culture that values sports over education results in worse outcomes for those kids. It's an inferior culture. A culture which encourages primitive and superstitious practices results in worse outcomes for those kids. It's an inferior culture. The trouble is that you cannot actually win any argument in trying to "uplift" or "enlighten" people by asking them to reject what they consider parts of their culture. To many people, just pointing out that what they consider "normal" is actually detrimental to their kids is considered an attack on themselves by an oppressive bigot. There are cultures who consider any form of non-humanities education to be oppression. You aren't going to fix them by simply moving them into a new environment. They usually take their beliefs with them. Whites don't have the best outcomes, Asians have better outcomes (I think Hasidic Jews have the best, but I am not sure). That's not because of race, it's because of different cultures[1]. There are multiple different cultures even in the same race group! So it's quite confusing to me why you immediately and so quickly responded to a race-based argument that was never made. Some cultures really are inferior to others, but I don't know how you'd go about uplifting those cultures at the bottom of the performance spectrum while remaining politically correct. [1] What we really need is a study that looked specifically at things like Asian kids growing up in a black neighbourhood, or black kids adopted by Hasidic jews, or similar.
- lern_too_spel 4y ago
  > Who said that? Who said I said that anybody said that? I was giving an example of something that actually is politically incorrect, which your example wasn't. > Once again, who actually did that? I figured that you might, and indeed you did in the next sentence. > A culture that normalises or encourages single parents over the alternatives results in worse outcomes for those kids. Slaves were not permitted to marry. Children of unmarried slaves learned how to live from their unmarried parents. You're blaming the victims instead of helping them. In the next paragraphs you claim that they want to live this way and that this can't be changed. After the fall of the Roman empire, Europeans didn't bathe except a few times in their life, living in filth and dying of filth-related diseases. This didn't change until enlightenment thinking forced upon them caused large culture shifts. > Whites don't have the best outcomes, Asians have better outcomes Tell that to Indians living in India. Tell that to children of Chinese migrant workers, including the descendants of railroad workers living in Chinatown slums today. https://clb.org.hk/content/migrant-workers-and-their-children https://clb.org.hk/content/migrant-workers-and-their-childre... Tell that to children of Nigerian immigrants. https://medium.com/@joecarleton/why-nigerian-immigrants-are-the-most-successful-ethnic-group-in-the-u-s-23a7ea5a0832 https://medium.com/@joecarleton/why-nigerian-immigrants-are-...
  - lelanthran 4y ago
    > Slaves were not permitted to marry. Children of unmarried slaves learned how to live from their unmarried parents. You're blaming the victims instead of helping them. We aren't talking slaves, we're talking about people who are, by and large, free to make their own life choices. > In the next paragraphs you claim that they want to live this way and that this can't be changed. I did not make that claim, nor did I make any claims about slaves, ancient romans and/or europeans. Your argument appears to work only when used against extremes. I merely pointed out that people right now, not hundreds of years ago, are free to make life choices regarding education. That certain cultures do not prioritize education as much as others is not a point of contention. > Tell that to children of Nigerian immigrants. https://medium.com/@joecarleton/why-nigerian-immigrants-are- https://medium.com/@joecarleton/why-nigerian-immigrants-are-... You appear to be making my argument for me - that race is not a factor, but culture is. Those immigrant Nigerians are the same race as non-immigrant blacks in the US, but have better outcomes. That very article clearly shows how that culture prioritises education.

lelanthran 4y ago

> It is both scientifically and politically incorrect to say that parenting doesn't matter, only the color of the child's skin. Who said that? Looks and sounds like a strawman, otherwise why are you responding to a race-based argument that was never made? > It is politically incorrect to blame people who are in these situations instead of bringing about the change to fix it. Once again, who actually did that? Another strawman? A culture that normalises or encourages single parents over the alternatives results in worse outcomes for those kids. It's an inferior culture. A culture that values sports over education results in worse outcomes for those kids. It's an inferior culture. A culture which encourages primitive and superstitious practices results in worse outcomes for those kids. It's an inferior culture. The trouble is that you cannot actually win any argument in trying to "uplift" or "enlighten" people by asking them to reject what they consider parts of their culture. To many people, just pointing out that what they consider "normal" is actually detrimental to their kids is considered an attack on themselves by an oppressive bigot. There are cultures who consider any form of non-humanities education to be oppression. You aren't going to fix them by simply moving them into a new environment. They usually take their beliefs with them. Whites don't have the best outcomes, Asians have better outcomes (I think Hasidic Jews have the best, but I am not sure). That's not because of race, it's because of different cultures[1]. There are multiple different cultures even in the same race group! So it's quite confusing to me why you immediately and so quickly responded to a race-based argument that was never made. Some cultures really are inferior to others, but I don't know how you'd go about uplifting those cultures at the bottom of the performance spectrum while remaining politically correct. [1] What we really need is a study that looked specifically at things like Asian kids growing up in a black neighbourhood, or black kids adopted by Hasidic jews, or similar.

lern_too_spel 4y ago
> Who said that? Who said I said that anybody said that? I was giving an example of something that actually is politically incorrect, which your example wasn't. > Once again, who actually did that? I figured that you might, and indeed you did in the next sentence. > A culture that normalises or encourages single parents over the alternatives results in worse outcomes for those kids. Slaves were not permitted to marry. Children of unmarried slaves learned how to live from their unmarried parents. You're blaming the victims instead of helping them. In the next paragraphs you claim that they want to live this way and that this can't be changed. After the fall of the Roman empire, Europeans didn't bathe except a few times in their life, living in filth and dying of filth-related diseases. This didn't change until enlightenment thinking forced upon them caused large culture shifts. > Whites don't have the best outcomes, Asians have better outcomes Tell that to Indians living in India. Tell that to children of Chinese migrant workers, including the descendants of railroad workers living in Chinatown slums today. https://clb.org.hk/content/migrant-workers-and-their-children https://clb.org.hk/content/migrant-workers-and-their-childre... Tell that to children of Nigerian immigrants. https://medium.com/@joecarleton/why-nigerian-immigrants-are-the-most-successful-ethnic-group-in-the-u-s-23a7ea5a0832 https://medium.com/@joecarleton/why-nigerian-immigrants-are-...
- lelanthran 4y ago
  > Slaves were not permitted to marry. Children of unmarried slaves learned how to live from their unmarried parents. You're blaming the victims instead of helping them. We aren't talking slaves, we're talking about people who are, by and large, free to make their own life choices. > In the next paragraphs you claim that they want to live this way and that this can't be changed. I did not make that claim, nor did I make any claims about slaves, ancient romans and/or europeans. Your argument appears to work only when used against extremes. I merely pointed out that people right now, not hundreds of years ago, are free to make life choices regarding education. That certain cultures do not prioritize education as much as others is not a point of contention. > Tell that to children of Nigerian immigrants. https://medium.com/@joecarleton/why-nigerian-immigrants-are- https://medium.com/@joecarleton/why-nigerian-immigrants-are-... You appear to be making my argument for me - that race is not a factor, but culture is. Those immigrant Nigerians are the same race as non-immigrant blacks in the US, but have better outcomes. That very article clearly shows how that culture prioritises education.