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I bought FSD version of Model 3 in the spring of 2020. I'm still waiting for what I purchased to be turned on. Frankly, I'd be psyched if they would expand on t

I bought FSD version of Model 3 in the spring of 2020. I'm still waiting for what I purchased to be turned on. Frankly, I'd be psyched if they would expand on the little things instead of the big things. "Park the car in that spot". "Exit the parking spot". These would be worth the price I paid.

toast0 4y ago
I don't see why you don't return the car? It doesn't have what you paid for.
avalys 4y ago
No kidding! The ability to use the phone or remote to move the car forward or back in a straight line is super useful and a cool, novel feature by itself. It’s also a buggy piece of shit that a few engineers could probably greatly improve in a month. Doesn’t seem like Tesla cares, it’s been stagnant for years. Meanwhile Tesla is still charging people $10,000 for an FSD function that doesn’t exist.
- mvgoogler 4y ago
  It's up to $12,000 now. https://www.tesla.com/model3/design#overview https://www.tesla.com/model3/design#overview
- pclmulqdq 4y ago
  The charge isn't really for the FSD functionality. It's a charge to cut the line. There is a long waitlist if you don't pay for FSD.
  - jcheng 4y ago
    That doesn’t appear to be true; on Tesla’s site, the delivery estimate doesn’t change if you add the FSD option. Unless you’re saying it’s an undocumented policy?
  - fma 4y ago
    A waitlist...for a firmware update?
    - HWR_14 4y ago
      They're claiming that the FSD equipped Tesla waitlist is resolved before the non-FSD waitlist. It seems trivial to verify, but it is possible that FSD cars are shipped faster without It being noticed. Maybe by shipping FSD cars at something like twice the rate they are ordered.
- cranekam 4y ago
  > The ability to use the phone or remote to move the car forward or back in a straight line is super useful and a cool, novel feature by itself. Is it? It’s hard to think of a situation where moving a car I’m at most a couple of hundred feet from backward or forwards in a straight line by fiddling with my phone is superior to just getting into the car and moving it myself. Maybe I’m not finding myself and my car on opposite sides of a gorge often enough?
  - avalys 4y ago
    I found it useful in a variety of circumstances. Someone parked too close to your driver's door? Just back the car out remotely and get in. Parallel parked, then walked away from your car and noticed you didn't leave the car behind enough space to exit without scraping your bumper? Pull it forward a little without getting back in. Parked in your driveway and need to move it three feet so you have space to get the lawnmower out of the garage? Use the remote. All of these use cases depend on the functionality being fast and hassle-free to use. It works that well about 60% of the time - the other 40% the phone fails to connect to the car, or seems to connect but the car inexplicably doesn't move, or gives a useless "Something went wrong" error message, etc.
    - bamboozled 4y ago
      Of all the scenarios you describe, they happen to me once in 5 years, even then, I can’t help but feel it’s just being lazy using a remote instead of just moving the car ?
      - glitchcrab 4y ago
        It's not even lazy, it's just plain gimmicky. Aside from the door being blocked in scenario, it would take longer to get your phone out, open the app and tap through the interface than it would to just get in the car and move it. It's just a toy feature with very few genuinely valuable uses.
        macintux 4y ago
- hedora 4y ago
  What happens if the phone UI thread / touch screen hangs?
  - ggreer 4y ago
    By default you have to continuously press a button to move the car. Also the car has cameras and ultrasonic sensors. You can set thresholds for how close you want the car to get to obstacles. I think the default is 2 feet. The car will refuse to move if it thinks it's too close to an obstacle. I think the top speed is 1 or 2 mph, and the car emits a warning sound as it moves. I mostly use the summon feature for annoyances such as someone parking too close to me or rain causing a puddle to form around the car.
TulliusCicero 4y ago
The fact that we don't have reliable, fully automated parking yet is bizarre. I'd love a solution that automatically parallel parks for me, and a computer with sensors around the vehicle should be able to do a better job. Plus, the problem is of limited scope, and low speed, so you don't have to deal with most of the potential issues and dangers with full self driving on a road.
- causality0 4y ago
  Ford does that with Active Park Assist.
  - lima 4y ago
    Mercedes too, here's a demo: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hz4Bm2jui-c https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hz4Bm2jui-c
    - 331c8c71 4y ago
      Also Peugeot/Citroen and VW/Audi. Probably all major car manufacturers have it by now?
      - nraynaud 4y ago
        Now that I see your list of manufacturers, I can only think: “of course, manufacturers don’t do squat in a car, Bosh, or some other equipment company did it and sold it to all the manufacturers”
        rootusrootus 4y ago
        That's pretty typical. And sometimes when the car manufacturer gets particularly good at parts subsystems, they spin that off into a separate company. E.g. Delphi. It's nice, because then we see awesome things like magnetic ride show up on more than just GM performance cars.
- 4y ago
causality0 4y ago
I bought FSD version of Model 3 in the spring of 2020 I don't understand how people keep falling for this. Sure, it seemed realistic enough at first but how many cracks in the facade are too many to ignore? In 2015 Musk said two years. In 2016 he said two years. In 2017 he said two years. Tesla did a 180 on the fundamental requirements of FSD and decided it doesn't need lidar just because they had a falling-out with their lidar supplier. That level of ego-driven horseshit is dangerous.
- bagels 4y ago
  It's still not actually available to people who paid for it, and it doesn't actually work* (at least not to a degree where it can be trusted not to crash in to street signs or parked cars). I have no idea why anyone pays a $10k premium for vaporware.
  - netsharc 4y ago
    Gotta love the apologists as well, because hey, if I admit I was conned out of money for some buggy-ass deadly software, then who's the idiot, and I know I'm not an idiot, so this software works, yeah it has a few kinks, but it's great, and soon it'll be chaffeuring me all over the place! Soon! He tweeted!
  - pengaru 4y ago
    I suspect the venn diagram of people paying $10k for Tesla vaporware and people who've realized >$10k in gains trading TSLA stock is pretty close to a circle.
    - bagels 4y ago
      I think that is actually a decent point. Definitely know people that bought Teslas with their Tesla stock gains.
      - cecilpl2 4y ago
        I've made enough off TSLA to afford a Tesla, but I'm actually now considering the Ioniq 5 over the Model Y. Specs are very similar and it's like 2/3 the price. I've been a believer in Tesla for a decade now but it is starting to seem like the competition is catching up.
Geee 4y ago
If you have been following their updates, it looks like that they have finally found the correct approach for FSD and it is improving very quickly. At this rate, it seems that it'll be close to level 5 this year or next year. Video of the latest version: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fwduh2kRj3M https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fwduh2kRj3M
- ec109685 4y ago
  I have the beta (finally). It’s very very rough.
  - fastball 4y ago
    So would you say your experience is very different from the one shown in this video[1], or is it that you'd describe the video as very very rough? [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fwduh2kRj3M https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fwduh2kRj3M
    - flutas 4y ago
      I have the beta as well, it's very very rough. Like, trying to change lanes into a "flush median" (aka yellow stripes across) to turn onto a one way in the wrong direction. Or randomly swerving back and forth (hard) when a lane splits into 2. Or trying to take 90deg turns at 45mph. There are times it works amazingly, I've had it slow down and swerve out of the way of someone barreling out of a parking lot without stopping. It's also great at finding a gap to fit into between cars to turn, but it also got itself into that situation by not getting over sooner and instead trying to merge ~500ft before the turn. Also for some reason on a 2 lane road (in each direction) it would constantly try to be in the "passing" lane.
      - saalweachter 4y ago
        > Also for some reason on a 2 lane road (in each direction) it would constantly try to be in the "passing" lane. The problem with collecting real-world training data is that there are going to be a lot of assholes in your data.
modeless 4y ago
I got it this week. It's not really worth using in its current state. It makes minor mistakes every minute or two, major ones every five minutes or so. I bought it years ago mostly for the guaranteed computer upgrade and the novelty of testing it as it develops. It's great as a novelty, really cool! But it is dangerous to use right now, and I don't care what anyone says, it's not going to be truly ready for years. In fact I think it needs another computer upgrade and probably a camera upgrade too. I agree that they should have nailed autopark and summon before moving on to FSD. As it stands they are both useless. But if I could record and play back summon paths in known locations, that would be actually useful.
- buffington 4y ago
  > I bought it years ago mostly for the guaranteed computer upgrade and the novelty of testing it as it develops. I did the same, and it was significantly less expensive. I wouldn't buy it for a $1 today. Also, your idea of novelty is my idea of a nightmare. There has never been a time when I used it where it didn't do something completely insane. The last time I used it (which will truly be the last time), it waited patiently to make a left hand turn. It waited far longer than I would have, and it was clear of oncoming cars for ages. When it did decide to turn, it did it when there were several cars coming, though it was still safe. Except then half way through its turn, it literally stopped, then turned a bit to the right and centered itself in a lane going the opposite direction of traffic flow, right into oncoming cars. Thankfully I was able to take over and two of the three oncoming cars stopped. Had I done nothing, we would have all been in a head on collision. Never again.
  - propogandist 4y ago
    doesn’t the car have multiple video cams built in? Take the footage and upload it online, if you have it. I see Elon constantly interacting with fanboys hyping up autopilot features. One would get the impression that all features were perfect with the hype videos online.
    - modeless 4y ago
jm4 4y ago
I made the same mistake in 2019. $6000 for FSD. The car is an enigma. It is simultaneously wonderful and a total scam. My next one will be some other EV from another manufacturer. I would never buy another Tesla or anything else from Elon. Like the car, he is an enigma. I oscillate between believing he is brilliant and seeing him as a lying snake oil salesman. I can’t exactly say I’m disappointed with my purchase overall because it is a damn good EV, but I can’t help but feel like I was conned.

toast0 4y ago

I don't see why you don't return the car? It doesn't have what you paid for.

avalys 4y ago

No kidding! The ability to use the phone or remote to move the car forward or back in a straight line is super useful and a cool, novel feature by itself. It’s also a buggy piece of shit that a few engineers could probably greatly improve in a month. Doesn’t seem like Tesla cares, it’s been stagnant for years. Meanwhile Tesla is still charging people $10,000 for an FSD function that doesn’t exist.

mvgoogler 4y ago
It's up to $12,000 now. https://www.tesla.com/model3/design#overview https://www.tesla.com/model3/design#overview
pclmulqdq 4y ago
The charge isn't really for the FSD functionality. It's a charge to cut the line. There is a long waitlist if you don't pay for FSD.
- jcheng 4y ago
  That doesn’t appear to be true; on Tesla’s site, the delivery estimate doesn’t change if you add the FSD option. Unless you’re saying it’s an undocumented policy?
- fma 4y ago
  A waitlist...for a firmware update?
  - HWR_14 4y ago
    They're claiming that the FSD equipped Tesla waitlist is resolved before the non-FSD waitlist. It seems trivial to verify, but it is possible that FSD cars are shipped faster without It being noticed. Maybe by shipping FSD cars at something like twice the rate they are ordered.
cranekam 4y ago
> The ability to use the phone or remote to move the car forward or back in a straight line is super useful and a cool, novel feature by itself. Is it? It’s hard to think of a situation where moving a car I’m at most a couple of hundred feet from backward or forwards in a straight line by fiddling with my phone is superior to just getting into the car and moving it myself. Maybe I’m not finding myself and my car on opposite sides of a gorge often enough?
- avalys 4y ago
  I found it useful in a variety of circumstances. Someone parked too close to your driver's door? Just back the car out remotely and get in. Parallel parked, then walked away from your car and noticed you didn't leave the car behind enough space to exit without scraping your bumper? Pull it forward a little without getting back in. Parked in your driveway and need to move it three feet so you have space to get the lawnmower out of the garage? Use the remote. All of these use cases depend on the functionality being fast and hassle-free to use. It works that well about 60% of the time - the other 40% the phone fails to connect to the car, or seems to connect but the car inexplicably doesn't move, or gives a useless "Something went wrong" error message, etc.
  - bamboozled 4y ago
    Of all the scenarios you describe, they happen to me once in 5 years, even then, I can’t help but feel it’s just being lazy using a remote instead of just moving the car ?
    - glitchcrab 4y ago
      It's not even lazy, it's just plain gimmicky. Aside from the door being blocked in scenario, it would take longer to get your phone out, open the app and tap through the interface than it would to just get in the car and move it. It's just a toy feature with very few genuinely valuable uses.
      - macintux 4y ago
hedora 4y ago
What happens if the phone UI thread / touch screen hangs?
- ggreer 4y ago
  By default you have to continuously press a button to move the car. Also the car has cameras and ultrasonic sensors. You can set thresholds for how close you want the car to get to obstacles. I think the default is 2 feet. The car will refuse to move if it thinks it's too close to an obstacle. I think the top speed is 1 or 2 mph, and the car emits a warning sound as it moves. I mostly use the summon feature for annoyances such as someone parking too close to me or rain causing a puddle to form around the car.

TulliusCicero 4y ago

The fact that we don't have reliable, fully automated parking yet is bizarre. I'd love a solution that automatically parallel parks for me, and a computer with sensors around the vehicle should be able to do a better job. Plus, the problem is of limited scope, and low speed, so you don't have to deal with most of the potential issues and dangers with full self driving on a road.

causality0 4y ago
Ford does that with Active Park Assist.
- lima 4y ago
  Mercedes too, here's a demo: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hz4Bm2jui-c https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hz4Bm2jui-c
  - 331c8c71 4y ago
    Also Peugeot/Citroen and VW/Audi. Probably all major car manufacturers have it by now?
    - nraynaud 4y ago
      Now that I see your list of manufacturers, I can only think: “of course, manufacturers don’t do squat in a car, Bosh, or some other equipment company did it and sold it to all the manufacturers”
      - rootusrootus 4y ago
        That's pretty typical. And sometimes when the car manufacturer gets particularly good at parts subsystems, they spin that off into a separate company. E.g. Delphi. It's nice, because then we see awesome things like magnetic ride show up on more than just GM performance cars.
4y ago

causality0 4y ago

I bought FSD version of Model 3 in the spring of 2020 I don't understand how people keep falling for this. Sure, it seemed realistic enough at first but how many cracks in the facade are too many to ignore? In 2015 Musk said two years. In 2016 he said two years. In 2017 he said two years. Tesla did a 180 on the fundamental requirements of FSD and decided it doesn't need lidar just because they had a falling-out with their lidar supplier. That level of ego-driven horseshit is dangerous.

bagels 4y ago
It's still not actually available to people who paid for it, and it doesn't actually work* (at least not to a degree where it can be trusted not to crash in to street signs or parked cars). I have no idea why anyone pays a $10k premium for vaporware.
- netsharc 4y ago
  Gotta love the apologists as well, because hey, if I admit I was conned out of money for some buggy-ass deadly software, then who's the idiot, and I know I'm not an idiot, so this software works, yeah it has a few kinks, but it's great, and soon it'll be chaffeuring me all over the place! Soon! He tweeted!
- pengaru 4y ago
  I suspect the venn diagram of people paying $10k for Tesla vaporware and people who've realized >$10k in gains trading TSLA stock is pretty close to a circle.
  - bagels 4y ago
    I think that is actually a decent point. Definitely know people that bought Teslas with their Tesla stock gains.
    - cecilpl2 4y ago
      I've made enough off TSLA to afford a Tesla, but I'm actually now considering the Ioniq 5 over the Model Y. Specs are very similar and it's like 2/3 the price. I've been a believer in Tesla for a decade now but it is starting to seem like the competition is catching up.

Geee 4y ago

If you have been following their updates, it looks like that they have finally found the correct approach for FSD and it is improving very quickly. At this rate, it seems that it'll be close to level 5 this year or next year. Video of the latest version: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fwduh2kRj3M https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fwduh2kRj3M

ec109685 4y ago
I have the beta (finally). It’s very very rough.
- fastball 4y ago
  So would you say your experience is very different from the one shown in this video[1], or is it that you'd describe the video as very very rough? [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fwduh2kRj3M https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fwduh2kRj3M
  - flutas 4y ago
    I have the beta as well, it's very very rough. Like, trying to change lanes into a "flush median" (aka yellow stripes across) to turn onto a one way in the wrong direction. Or randomly swerving back and forth (hard) when a lane splits into 2. Or trying to take 90deg turns at 45mph. There are times it works amazingly, I've had it slow down and swerve out of the way of someone barreling out of a parking lot without stopping. It's also great at finding a gap to fit into between cars to turn, but it also got itself into that situation by not getting over sooner and instead trying to merge ~500ft before the turn. Also for some reason on a 2 lane road (in each direction) it would constantly try to be in the "passing" lane.
    - saalweachter 4y ago
      > Also for some reason on a 2 lane road (in each direction) it would constantly try to be in the "passing" lane. The problem with collecting real-world training data is that there are going to be a lot of assholes in your data.

modeless 4y ago

I got it this week. It's not really worth using in its current state. It makes minor mistakes every minute or two, major ones every five minutes or so. I bought it years ago mostly for the guaranteed computer upgrade and the novelty of testing it as it develops. It's great as a novelty, really cool! But it is dangerous to use right now, and I don't care what anyone says, it's not going to be truly ready for years. In fact I think it needs another computer upgrade and probably a camera upgrade too. I agree that they should have nailed autopark and summon before moving on to FSD. As it stands they are both useless. But if I could record and play back summon paths in known locations, that would be actually useful.

buffington 4y ago
> I bought it years ago mostly for the guaranteed computer upgrade and the novelty of testing it as it develops. I did the same, and it was significantly less expensive. I wouldn't buy it for a $1 today. Also, your idea of novelty is my idea of a nightmare. There has never been a time when I used it where it didn't do something completely insane. The last time I used it (which will truly be the last time), it waited patiently to make a left hand turn. It waited far longer than I would have, and it was clear of oncoming cars for ages. When it did decide to turn, it did it when there were several cars coming, though it was still safe. Except then half way through its turn, it literally stopped, then turned a bit to the right and centered itself in a lane going the opposite direction of traffic flow, right into oncoming cars. Thankfully I was able to take over and two of the three oncoming cars stopped. Had I done nothing, we would have all been in a head on collision. Never again.
- propogandist 4y ago
  doesn’t the car have multiple video cams built in? Take the footage and upload it online, if you have it. I see Elon constantly interacting with fanboys hyping up autopilot features. One would get the impression that all features were perfect with the hype videos online.
  - modeless 4y ago

jm4 4y ago

I made the same mistake in 2019. $6000 for FSD. The car is an enigma. It is simultaneously wonderful and a total scam. My next one will be some other EV from another manufacturer. I would never buy another Tesla or anything else from Elon. Like the car, he is an enigma. I oscillate between believing he is brilliant and seeing him as a lying snake oil salesman. I can’t exactly say I’m disappointed with my purchase overall because it is a damn good EV, but I can’t help but feel like I was conned.