4 ms·

Mearsheimer on why the West is principally responsible for the Ukrainian crisis

8 points by kwatsonafter 4y ago

kwatsonafter 4y ago
I'm interested in what HN readers from India, Pakistan, and other Global South countries feel about this perspective.
clouddrover 4y ago
> Furthermore, Russian policymakers—including Mr Putin—have said hardly anything about conquering new territory to recreate the Soviet Union or build a greater Russia. Putin has now said exactly that. He sees himself as reclaiming Russian territory: https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-61767191 https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-61767191 > Rather, since the 2008 Bucharest summit Russian leaders have repeatedly said that they view Ukraine joining NATO as an existential threat that must be prevented. NATO is a defensive alliance. Russia's actions are only causing the growth of NATO with Finland and Sweden now moving to join: https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-18023383 https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-18023383 If Russia genuinely believed NATO to be an existential threat then Russia wouldn't act in a manner that encourages the expansion of NATO membership. In the end, Putin is responsible for the Ukrainian crisis and the Russian people are responsible for Putin and the Russian government. The cost of the Russian people's inability to get their government under control is now being measured in both Ukrainian and Russian lives.
- cato_the_elder 4y ago
  > NATO is a defensive alliance. Which NATO member was being defended when they bombed Yugoslavia? [1] Putin is a dictator, but that shouldn't cause us to take NATO propaganda at its face value. [1]: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/NATO_bombing_of_Yugoslavia https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/NATO_bombing_of_Yugoslavia
  - Gibbon1 4y ago
    > bombed Yugoslavia? You mean Serbia.
timonoko 4y ago
Endgame will be most interesting. Historically speaking. -- If Russia "wins" and takes all of Ukraine, they have to dispose 30 million people. Germans tried this industrial scale, and they managed only 6 million. In Baltic states there was terrorist groups aka "Forest Brothers", which managed survive 50 years until Russia finally lost. Ukrainian Forest Brothers will be much more. They will be aided by Elon Musk satellites and ever improving armament. Russia cannot compete will 25 Mhz processors and diminishing population for 50 years. - If Russia "loses" and gives up all territories in Ukraine, somebody has to rebuild Ukraine. It will cost TeraEuros. Russia does not have these kind of monies, even it is split in pieces and wrung dry.
gardenfelder 4y ago
https://archive.ph/aAgwr https://archive.ph/aAgwr

8 points by kwatsonafter 4y ago

I'm interested in what HN readers from India, Pakistan, and other Global South countries feel about this perspective.

> Furthermore, Russian policymakers—including Mr Putin—have said hardly anything about conquering new territory to recreate the Soviet Union or build a greater Russia. Putin has now said exactly that. He sees himself as reclaiming Russian territory: https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-61767191 https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-61767191 > Rather, since the 2008 Bucharest summit Russian leaders have repeatedly said that they view Ukraine joining NATO as an existential threat that must be prevented. NATO is a defensive alliance. Russia's actions are only causing the growth of NATO with Finland and Sweden now moving to join: https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-18023383 https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-18023383 If Russia genuinely believed NATO to be an existential threat then Russia wouldn't act in a manner that encourages the expansion of NATO membership. In the end, Putin is responsible for the Ukrainian crisis and the Russian people are responsible for Putin and the Russian government. The cost of the Russian people's inability to get their government under control is now being measured in both Ukrainian and Russian lives.

cato_the_elder 4y ago
> NATO is a defensive alliance. Which NATO member was being defended when they bombed Yugoslavia? [1] Putin is a dictator, but that shouldn't cause us to take NATO propaganda at its face value. [1]: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/NATO_bombing_of_Yugoslavia https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/NATO_bombing_of_Yugoslavia
- Gibbon1 4y ago
  > bombed Yugoslavia? You mean Serbia.

timonoko 4y ago

Endgame will be most interesting. Historically speaking. -- If Russia "wins" and takes all of Ukraine, they have to dispose 30 million people. Germans tried this industrial scale, and they managed only 6 million. In Baltic states there was terrorist groups aka "Forest Brothers", which managed survive 50 years until Russia finally lost. Ukrainian Forest Brothers will be much more. They will be aided by Elon Musk satellites and ever improving armament. Russia cannot compete will 25 Mhz processors and diminishing population for 50 years. - If Russia "loses" and gives up all territories in Ukraine, somebody has to rebuild Ukraine. It will cost TeraEuros. Russia does not have these kind of monies, even it is split in pieces and wrung dry.

gardenfelder 4y ago

https://archive.ph/aAgwr https://archive.ph/aAgwr