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In the US market average customers can barely handle SIMs. Letting customers handle their SIP credentials would amplify number hijacking and customer side telec

In the US market average customers can barely handle SIMs. Letting customers handle their SIP credentials would amplify number hijacking and customer side telecom fraud.

Nextgrid 4y ago
I don't see any cases where customers are misusing SIMs that would expose them to fraud at a large-scale. What I see instead is customer service being staffed by monkeys that are too stupid to realize they're being social-engineered, don't care or are outright complicit in the fraud.
- ggping 4y ago
  Having worked in customer service decades ago, I wouldn't call them stupid monkeys. Designing your 2F authentication around SIM-based telcom is perhaps more appropriate to obtain the title of "stupid".
  - Nextgrid 4y ago
    I'm sure there are good ones in the mix but that doesn't match my experience with any mainstream consumer-grade carrier or ISP. It doesn't have to be that way but obviously until carriers are held accountable and/or their oligopoly is broken they have no incentive to improve things. While it's true that SMS 2FA is flawed, that still isn't an excuse for letting customers' phone numbers being taken over by very unsophisticated attacks, sometimes even if notes are added to the account (or a PIN) that explicitly warn against such attacks. Also, I'm not sure how much of "decades ago" is hyperbole but back in the day ISP/telco support was a great career path and would allow you to learn and move up the ranks towards a more technical position. Nowadays "support" in any customer-grade ISP/telco is a dead-end position that's there to be exploited as much as possible (in fact it's often outsourced to a boiler room abroad, probably right next to the tech-support scammers) and replaced by a new sucker as soon as you burn out. Obviously this kind of treatment doesn't attract the right talent nor inspire goodwill in said talent.
- supertrope 4y ago
  Customer side as in whoever controls the SIM/credentials/handset. It would also need an inordinate amount of support. Customers are used to SIMs being preinstalled. Just imagine customers forgetting their SIP password or being phished for them. Or using Password1!

In the US market average customers can barely handle SIMs. Letting customers handle their SIP credentials would amplify number hijacking and customer side telecom fraud.

Nextgrid 4y ago

I don't see any cases where customers are misusing SIMs that would expose them to fraud at a large-scale. What I see instead is customer service being staffed by monkeys that are too stupid to realize they're being social-engineered, don't care or are outright complicit in the fraud.

ggping 4y ago
Having worked in customer service decades ago, I wouldn't call them stupid monkeys. Designing your 2F authentication around SIM-based telcom is perhaps more appropriate to obtain the title of "stupid".
- Nextgrid 4y ago
  I'm sure there are good ones in the mix but that doesn't match my experience with any mainstream consumer-grade carrier or ISP. It doesn't have to be that way but obviously until carriers are held accountable and/or their oligopoly is broken they have no incentive to improve things. While it's true that SMS 2FA is flawed, that still isn't an excuse for letting customers' phone numbers being taken over by very unsophisticated attacks, sometimes even if notes are added to the account (or a PIN) that explicitly warn against such attacks. Also, I'm not sure how much of "decades ago" is hyperbole but back in the day ISP/telco support was a great career path and would allow you to learn and move up the ranks towards a more technical position. Nowadays "support" in any customer-grade ISP/telco is a dead-end position that's there to be exploited as much as possible (in fact it's often outsourced to a boiler room abroad, probably right next to the tech-support scammers) and replaced by a new sucker as soon as you burn out. Obviously this kind of treatment doesn't attract the right talent nor inspire goodwill in said talent.
supertrope 4y ago
Customer side as in whoever controls the SIM/credentials/handset. It would also need an inordinate amount of support. Customers are used to SIMs being preinstalled. Just imagine customers forgetting their SIP password or being phished for them. Or using Password1!