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I defense of those existing blockchains: the annual worldwide energy usage of blockchain technology is roughly equal to the annual US energy waste from machines

I defense of those existing blockchains: the annual worldwide energy usage of blockchain technology is roughly equal to the annual US energy waste from machines plugged in while in standby mode. It is also significantly lower than the annual worldwide usage of Christmas lights, and wash dryers.

bromuro 4y ago
https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-56012952 https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-56012952 “Bitcoin consumes 'more electricity than Argentina'”
- once_inc 4y ago
  "Christmas lights consume more electricity than Argentina." "Wash dryers consume more electricity than Argentina." "Steel foundries consume more electricity than Argentina." What is the point? Comparing global electricity usage of a single sector and comparing it to the usage of a whole country is meaningless.
  - headsupernova 4y ago
    Those things produce joy, dry clothes, and steel. Crypto produces... scams? We're facing climate collapse and need to choose what we burn electricity on very very wisely.
    - NoGravitas 4y ago
      Honestly, I'd be in favor of banning Christmas lights.
      - saalweachter 4y ago
        The Christmas lights number is a little deceptive because it is comparing instantaneous draw and not yearly consumption. When all (US) Christmas lights are on, it might very well be equal to the draw of Bitcoin or Argentina; on a yearly basis, it's about 2-5%, depending on what estimate you are using. Christmas lights just aren't on for more than a week or two each year, by and large, and usually only for a few hours of each of those days. On a yearly basis, (US) Christmas lights use more electricity than Montenegro or El Salvador. It doesn't say anything about the worthiness of Christmas lights, but it makes them a much smaller gain if you eliminated them.
    - saalweachter 4y ago
      There is some good efficiency to be gained on clothes dryers. US clothes dryers account for 60 billion kWh / year and by and large rely on direct heating elements. Switching to a heat pump design could apparently cut that in half: https://www.energystar.gov/ia/partners/pt_awards/SEDI_Fact_Sheet_H.pdf https://www.energystar.gov/ia/partners/pt_awards/SEDI_Fact_S... It's the old saying about no silver bullets. There's a lot of small but meaningful low hanging fruit we could take advantage of that begins to add up in a big way.
papito 4y ago
The difference is that the world needs Xmas lights and washer dryers.
valw 4y ago
> the annual worldwide energy usage of blockchain technology is roughly equal to the annual US energy waste from machines plugged in while in standby mode. It is also significantly lower than the annual worldwide usage of Christmas lights, and wash dryers. ... and it benefits much, much fewer people. That's analogous to the pro-air-travel disinformation argument: "air travel is only 2% of CO2 emissions". It is only so because air travel is only adopted by a small minority of people: that doesn't stop it from being insanely carbon-intensive.
saalweachter 4y ago
US spam postal mail also releases a comparable amount of CO2. These facts don't provide a defense of one or the other as "not that bad"; these give us multiple opportunities to make small but meaningful reductions in waste with relatively little impact on the quality of life of the world at large.
- NoGravitas 4y ago
  Yes, please. Ban both bitcoin mining and junk mail; there are absolutely no downsides to this.

bromuro 4y ago

https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-56012952 https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-56012952 “Bitcoin consumes 'more electricity than Argentina'”

once_inc 4y ago
"Christmas lights consume more electricity than Argentina." "Wash dryers consume more electricity than Argentina." "Steel foundries consume more electricity than Argentina." What is the point? Comparing global electricity usage of a single sector and comparing it to the usage of a whole country is meaningless.
- headsupernova 4y ago
  Those things produce joy, dry clothes, and steel. Crypto produces... scams? We're facing climate collapse and need to choose what we burn electricity on very very wisely.
  - NoGravitas 4y ago
    Honestly, I'd be in favor of banning Christmas lights.
    - saalweachter 4y ago
      The Christmas lights number is a little deceptive because it is comparing instantaneous draw and not yearly consumption. When all (US) Christmas lights are on, it might very well be equal to the draw of Bitcoin or Argentina; on a yearly basis, it's about 2-5%, depending on what estimate you are using. Christmas lights just aren't on for more than a week or two each year, by and large, and usually only for a few hours of each of those days. On a yearly basis, (US) Christmas lights use more electricity than Montenegro or El Salvador. It doesn't say anything about the worthiness of Christmas lights, but it makes them a much smaller gain if you eliminated them.
  - saalweachter 4y ago
    There is some good efficiency to be gained on clothes dryers. US clothes dryers account for 60 billion kWh / year and by and large rely on direct heating elements. Switching to a heat pump design could apparently cut that in half: https://www.energystar.gov/ia/partners/pt_awards/SEDI_Fact_Sheet_H.pdf https://www.energystar.gov/ia/partners/pt_awards/SEDI_Fact_S... It's the old saying about no silver bullets. There's a lot of small but meaningful low hanging fruit we could take advantage of that begins to add up in a big way.

papito 4y ago

The difference is that the world needs Xmas lights and washer dryers.

valw 4y ago

> the annual worldwide energy usage of blockchain technology is roughly equal to the annual US energy waste from machines plugged in while in standby mode. It is also significantly lower than the annual worldwide usage of Christmas lights, and wash dryers. ... and it benefits much, much fewer people. That's analogous to the pro-air-travel disinformation argument: "air travel is only 2% of CO2 emissions". It is only so because air travel is only adopted by a small minority of people: that doesn't stop it from being insanely carbon-intensive.

saalweachter 4y ago

US spam postal mail also releases a comparable amount of CO2. These facts don't provide a defense of one or the other as "not that bad"; these give us multiple opportunities to make small but meaningful reductions in waste with relatively little impact on the quality of life of the world at large.

NoGravitas 4y ago
Yes, please. Ban both bitcoin mining and junk mail; there are absolutely no downsides to this.