5 ms·

It feels like the history is repeating itself. The people of Nazi Germany probably thought they were doing the "right thing". These Chinese students have been b

by jp0d 4y ago

It feels like the history is repeating itself. The people of Nazi Germany probably thought they were doing the "right thing". These Chinese students have been brainwashed enough to believe everything their government says. Or may be even paid well enough to act like that!

jjcc 4y ago
The brainwashed cannot know they are brainwashed. So they feeling might be in the other way: They know the truth and you are brainwashed. I bet you and many HNer's won't be able to understand what I said. There is another saying: The new version of Nazi will be reincarnated as anti-Nazi which might or might not be true. Human has nature cognitive defects caused by the evolution not being able to catch up the pace of changing society. It causes conflicts, war and even self destruction. Edit/Fix:was Human has nature cognitive defects caused by not being able to catch up the pace of evolution.
- deltaonefour 4y ago
  Both are brainwashed. Basically all Americans are completely incapable of sympathizing in any way with Chinese perspective. Nobody agrees with the Chinese government but at the same time basically no one is also able to explain the reasoning from the Chinese perspective. The lack of the ability to disagree while at the same time understanding the Chinese perspective indicates a huge amount of bias. It's very easy to see this. Literally ask the person you responded why the Chinese government acted the way they did. What motivated them? Likely he will give simpleton answers like "power corrupts" or dictatorships are evil without ever understanding the complexity of the situation.
  - logicchains 4y ago
    >What motivated them? Likely he will give simpleton answers like "power corrupts" or dictatorships are evil without ever understanding the complexity of the situation. The motivation is very simple: the Uighurs started a separatist movement, and there's little the Chinese government hates more than separatist movements. Now, many governments in the world don't like separatist movements, but you don't see the Spanish government putting Catalonians in concentration camps and forcibly sterilising them. It's not brainwashed to believe forcibly sterilising people is unacceptable, it's basic Judeo-Christian/humanist values.
    - deltaonefour 4y ago
      - midasuni 4y ago
        The attacks were similar in scale to the Irish attacks in the 70s through 90s. Did the U.K. sterilise Irish people?
        deltaonefour 4y ago
        No they didn't. What's your point? I never said what the Chinese did is justified. My point is that emotions that launched the sterilization campaign is equivalent to the state of the US during 9/11. This doesn't justify genocide or actual war or does it? The US, on the other hand, thought sending soldiers to another country to kill more people was justified. China isnt doing that. But that's besides the point. The point is how do you know you're brainwashed? When a person completely failed to even mention why china did what they did instead just said oh china sterilized a culture because of a "separatist movement." It shows bias, lack of understanding and over simplification of a complex situation. White Americans dropped a nuclear bomb on Hiroshima effectively massacring an entire city with white fire. Does that make Americans evil? No it absolutely does not. Does that make the bomb justified? Also no. The point is to not place people into caricatures of right/wrong or good/evil when reality is by far much more complex. Why did china suppress the uhgyrs? If you can understand china but at the same time disagree with their actions then you have my respect. But if you can't do that... Then how are you different from a white supremacist who hates black people using over simplified reasoning and logic? Nobody here is understanding why the Chinese students did what they did.
        logicchains 4y ago
        >My point is that emotions that launched the sterilization campaign is equivalent to the state of the US during 9/11. This doesn't justify genocide or actual war or does it? The US, on the other hand, thought sending soldiers to another country to kill more people was justified. China isnt doing that. Were American university students overseas protesting at any criticism of the Iraq war? No; if anything US university students were the most anti-war Americans, leading protests against it, as would be expected of people with a higher level of education/moral development.
colordrops 4y ago
[flagged]
whimsicalism 4y ago
Comparing what is happening in Xinjiang to the Holocaust is Holocaust trivialization. They are not engaging in the organized murder of 11 million people. Not even close. Wish these gross comparisons for obvious political reasons (because we feel a rivalry with China) would end.
- xdennis 4y ago
  GP did not mention the Holocaust. You did! He metioned the Nazis, and the Nazis did not start with the Holocaust. They started with smaller antisemitic policies and ended with the Holocaust. China hasn't executed millions of Uyghurs yet, but there are no signs of them relaxing the persecutions so it could get a lot worse.
  - whimsicalism 4y ago
    Yeah, how silly of me to think that a reference to "history repeating itself" (commonly used in reference to the Holocaust) and the Nazis, would refer to their most notorious and infamous action. I'm sure they were referring to the Nazi's road construction initiatives.

by jp0d 4y ago

jjcc 4y ago

The brainwashed cannot know they are brainwashed. So they feeling might be in the other way: They know the truth and you are brainwashed. I bet you and many HNer's won't be able to understand what I said. There is another saying: The new version of Nazi will be reincarnated as anti-Nazi which might or might not be true. Human has nature cognitive defects caused by the evolution not being able to catch up the pace of changing society. It causes conflicts, war and even self destruction. Edit/Fix:was Human has nature cognitive defects caused by not being able to catch up the pace of evolution.

deltaonefour 4y ago
Both are brainwashed. Basically all Americans are completely incapable of sympathizing in any way with Chinese perspective. Nobody agrees with the Chinese government but at the same time basically no one is also able to explain the reasoning from the Chinese perspective. The lack of the ability to disagree while at the same time understanding the Chinese perspective indicates a huge amount of bias. It's very easy to see this. Literally ask the person you responded why the Chinese government acted the way they did. What motivated them? Likely he will give simpleton answers like "power corrupts" or dictatorships are evil without ever understanding the complexity of the situation.
- logicchains 4y ago
  >What motivated them? Likely he will give simpleton answers like "power corrupts" or dictatorships are evil without ever understanding the complexity of the situation. The motivation is very simple: the Uighurs started a separatist movement, and there's little the Chinese government hates more than separatist movements. Now, many governments in the world don't like separatist movements, but you don't see the Spanish government putting Catalonians in concentration camps and forcibly sterilising them. It's not brainwashed to believe forcibly sterilising people is unacceptable, it's basic Judeo-Christian/humanist values.
  - deltaonefour 4y ago
    - midasuni 4y ago
      The attacks were similar in scale to the Irish attacks in the 70s through 90s. Did the U.K. sterilise Irish people?
      - deltaonefour 4y ago
        No they didn't. What's your point? I never said what the Chinese did is justified. My point is that emotions that launched the sterilization campaign is equivalent to the state of the US during 9/11. This doesn't justify genocide or actual war or does it? The US, on the other hand, thought sending soldiers to another country to kill more people was justified. China isnt doing that. But that's besides the point. The point is how do you know you're brainwashed? When a person completely failed to even mention why china did what they did instead just said oh china sterilized a culture because of a "separatist movement." It shows bias, lack of understanding and over simplification of a complex situation. White Americans dropped a nuclear bomb on Hiroshima effectively massacring an entire city with white fire. Does that make Americans evil? No it absolutely does not. Does that make the bomb justified? Also no. The point is to not place people into caricatures of right/wrong or good/evil when reality is by far much more complex. Why did china suppress the uhgyrs? If you can understand china but at the same time disagree with their actions then you have my respect. But if you can't do that... Then how are you different from a white supremacist who hates black people using over simplified reasoning and logic? Nobody here is understanding why the Chinese students did what they did.
        logicchains 4y ago
        >My point is that emotions that launched the sterilization campaign is equivalent to the state of the US during 9/11. This doesn't justify genocide or actual war or does it? The US, on the other hand, thought sending soldiers to another country to kill more people was justified. China isnt doing that. Were American university students overseas protesting at any criticism of the Iraq war? No; if anything US university students were the most anti-war Americans, leading protests against it, as would be expected of people with a higher level of education/moral development.

colordrops 4y ago

[flagged]

whimsicalism 4y ago

Comparing what is happening in Xinjiang to the Holocaust is Holocaust trivialization. They are not engaging in the organized murder of 11 million people. Not even close. Wish these gross comparisons for obvious political reasons (because we feel a rivalry with China) would end.

xdennis 4y ago
GP did not mention the Holocaust. You did! He metioned the Nazis, and the Nazis did not start with the Holocaust. They started with smaller antisemitic policies and ended with the Holocaust. China hasn't executed millions of Uyghurs yet, but there are no signs of them relaxing the persecutions so it could get a lot worse.
- whimsicalism 4y ago
  Yeah, how silly of me to think that a reference to "history repeating itself" (commonly used in reference to the Holocaust) and the Nazis, would refer to their most notorious and infamous action. I'm sure they were referring to the Nazi's road construction initiatives.