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>Owning crypto != actually using it. How do you use bonds? in January, 10 trillion of debt wolrdwide was negative yield in nominal terms. in real terms - a wh

>Owning crypto != actually using it. How do you use bonds? in January, 10 trillion of debt wolrdwide was negative yield in nominal terms. in real terms - a whole lot more. Holding assets IS use. that's the root of your misunderstanding. For some reason everyone here is fixated on cheap payments. That's not what it's about.

kkielhofner 4y ago
I'll give you credit, deflecting to bonds is a new one! I'll quote myself: "It's really interesting that whenever I bring up blockchain explorers and the fact that blockchain has the most transparent and reliable adoption metrics ever no one takes me up on an analysis of the data and deflects to virtually anything else instead." Again, trading on crypto exchanges has nothing to do with the technology or use of a blockchain. I'm not fixated on payments. I don't care what the activity/use is as long as it uses the actual technology and network (which is reflected in blockchain explorers).
- forum_ghost 4y ago
  Bonds/digital gold/reserve currency angle isn’t new, I certainly didn’t invent it. You just haven’t spoken to very many people! Notice my comment did not include “trading”. Specifically only holding. Only demand to hold an asset for long durations gives it value long term. Gold and bonds are the perfect instances of this that most are familiar with. Bitcoin is an experiment in bootstrapping a new money from scratch. Before it can serve as a decent medium of exchange, it needs to first prove it can hold value first, as a store of value. Otherwise, how can you send value with it, if it can’t even store it value? It’s a necessary precursor. It is however quite volatile for now and only very few committed investors hold it long term. Who’d use a volatile asset for savings? For now it’s just a spec asset, and sure people are trading it, but as the market capitalisation growth, and fluctuations subside, it may very well become a decent medium of exchange. Trading is usage as well, as it increases network effects, and availability of the asset across different trading venues, thus increases market penetration. For the transition from SoV to MoE to occur, a large well dispersed number of holders is required. What difference does it make if they outsource the custody part? It makes sense for some, and regulated entities cannot warehouse it anywhere but a qualified custodian anyway. So sure, holding can occur on exchanges as well. If you must insist on the blockchain data, look at bitcoins money velocity. It is much closer to M2 than M1, and thus it acts today as a savings vehicle/investment asset: therefore much more similar to bonds than credit cards.

kkielhofner 4y ago

I'll give you credit, deflecting to bonds is a new one! I'll quote myself: "It's really interesting that whenever I bring up blockchain explorers and the fact that blockchain has the most transparent and reliable adoption metrics ever no one takes me up on an analysis of the data and deflects to virtually anything else instead." Again, trading on crypto exchanges has nothing to do with the technology or use of a blockchain. I'm not fixated on payments. I don't care what the activity/use is as long as it uses the actual technology and network (which is reflected in blockchain explorers).

forum_ghost 4y ago
Bonds/digital gold/reserve currency angle isn’t new, I certainly didn’t invent it. You just haven’t spoken to very many people! Notice my comment did not include “trading”. Specifically only holding. Only demand to hold an asset for long durations gives it value long term. Gold and bonds are the perfect instances of this that most are familiar with. Bitcoin is an experiment in bootstrapping a new money from scratch. Before it can serve as a decent medium of exchange, it needs to first prove it can hold value first, as a store of value. Otherwise, how can you send value with it, if it can’t even store it value? It’s a necessary precursor. It is however quite volatile for now and only very few committed investors hold it long term. Who’d use a volatile asset for savings? For now it’s just a spec asset, and sure people are trading it, but as the market capitalisation growth, and fluctuations subside, it may very well become a decent medium of exchange. Trading is usage as well, as it increases network effects, and availability of the asset across different trading venues, thus increases market penetration. For the transition from SoV to MoE to occur, a large well dispersed number of holders is required. What difference does it make if they outsource the custody part? It makes sense for some, and regulated entities cannot warehouse it anywhere but a qualified custodian anyway. So sure, holding can occur on exchanges as well. If you must insist on the blockchain data, look at bitcoins money velocity. It is much closer to M2 than M1, and thus it acts today as a savings vehicle/investment asset: therefore much more similar to bonds than credit cards.