5 ms·

Nice, but pause the video while it’s playing Bad Apple and you can measure the pixel response times. It looks like 8 frames or 133ms, which is pretty average fo

by db48x 4y ago

Nice, but pause the video while it’s playing Bad Apple and you can measure the pixel response times. It looks like 8 frames or 133ms, which is pretty average for Eink and terrible compared to the average LCD. Compare that with a review of a good monitor: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xDB9sONfJ5Q https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xDB9sONfJ5Q

chmod775 4y ago
It's an ordinary old e-ink screen, just driven in a different way.
SantalBlush 4y ago
So what? Someone made progress in an area I find interesting. That's much more useful to me than yet another comment that is crapping on someone else's work.
- db48x 4y ago
  But it isn’t progress. The refresh rate of the screen is still 130ms but now it’s being updated 8 times faster than that, before the pixels have changed color. Thus they continue changing color for the next eight frames before finally reaching either black or white. If your LCD panel did that you would toss it in the trash; most people cannot tolerate more than two or three frames of latency before complaining about motion blur and ghosting.
  - eternityforest 4y ago
    So they are basically feeding high frequency data into the e ink which low pass filters it? That's still progress, some of the high frequency information gets through, it's just blurred.
    - db48x 4y ago
      No, that isn’t what is going on. There’s no filter. It just updates the display at 60 Hz. If you simply pause the video you will see the result: the last eight frames are all visible at the same time, getting fainter as they get older. It makes every moving object look like it has a trail of ghosts following behind it. All LCD monitors have this problem to some extent, but cheap LCD monitors are the worst. This display is about 4× worse still. Update: Here, a screenshot: http://db48x.net/temp/Screenshot%20from%202022-06-09%2000-59-45.png http://db48x.net/temp/Screenshot%20from%202022-06-09%2000-59... This is taken right during the arm movement as she throws the apple up at the beginning of the video. Since she is drawn in black on a white background, the image of her arm from the current frame (at the top) is super faint. The pixels in the apple will never reach full black because they were supposed to be black for a frame and then go back to white next frame. They started darkening, but they are already being told to lighten again. The apple essentially disappears during this motion, and it’s supposed to be the focal element of the scene!
      - lagrange77 4y ago
        The inertia of the e ink itself is the low pass filter, i think.
        db48x 4y ago
        That’s just not a useful analogy.
        lagrange77 4y ago
        It wasn't meant as an analogy. Am i wrong in that the mass of the ink particles is the root cause for the low refresh rate of i ink displays?
        db48x 4y ago
        I have no idea why these displays are so slow, but the concept of a “low–pass filter” just doesn’t apply here.

by db48x 4y ago

chmod775 4y ago

It's an ordinary old e-ink screen, just driven in a different way.

SantalBlush 4y ago

So what? Someone made progress in an area I find interesting. That's much more useful to me than yet another comment that is crapping on someone else's work.

db48x 4y ago
But it isn’t progress. The refresh rate of the screen is still 130ms but now it’s being updated 8 times faster than that, before the pixels have changed color. Thus they continue changing color for the next eight frames before finally reaching either black or white. If your LCD panel did that you would toss it in the trash; most people cannot tolerate more than two or three frames of latency before complaining about motion blur and ghosting.
- eternityforest 4y ago
  So they are basically feeding high frequency data into the e ink which low pass filters it? That's still progress, some of the high frequency information gets through, it's just blurred.
  - db48x 4y ago
    No, that isn’t what is going on. There’s no filter. It just updates the display at 60 Hz. If you simply pause the video you will see the result: the last eight frames are all visible at the same time, getting fainter as they get older. It makes every moving object look like it has a trail of ghosts following behind it. All LCD monitors have this problem to some extent, but cheap LCD monitors are the worst. This display is about 4× worse still. Update: Here, a screenshot: http://db48x.net/temp/Screenshot%20from%202022-06-09%2000-59-45.png http://db48x.net/temp/Screenshot%20from%202022-06-09%2000-59... This is taken right during the arm movement as she throws the apple up at the beginning of the video. Since she is drawn in black on a white background, the image of her arm from the current frame (at the top) is super faint. The pixels in the apple will never reach full black because they were supposed to be black for a frame and then go back to white next frame. They started darkening, but they are already being told to lighten again. The apple essentially disappears during this motion, and it’s supposed to be the focal element of the scene!
    - lagrange77 4y ago
      The inertia of the e ink itself is the low pass filter, i think.
      - db48x 4y ago
        That’s just not a useful analogy.
        lagrange77 4y ago
        It wasn't meant as an analogy. Am i wrong in that the mass of the ink particles is the root cause for the low refresh rate of i ink displays?
        db48x 4y ago
        I have no idea why these displays are so slow, but the concept of a “low–pass filter” just doesn’t apply here.