3 ms·

They/them is only plural. It works ok in writing but IMO it sounds really weird to use it in casual conversation. I used to agree with the APA style guide that

by usrn 4y ago

They/them is only plural. It works ok in writing but IMO it sounds really weird to use it in casual conversation. I used to agree with the APA style guide that you should just use them but lately I've been having second thoughts.

tessierashpool 4y ago
this is a common misconception, but it isn't true, and it hasn't been true since the days of Shakespeare, who used they/them as a singular. Jane Austen did the same thing. I don't know who misinformed you on this topic, but I am willing to bet it was not a writer of that caliber. I think we can safely consider Shakespeare and Austen to be experts in the English language.
- sitharus 4y ago
  I wouldn't consider them experts on the language, since English is not a prescriptive language. However, they do provide good historical references on use of words to avoid the ridiculous 'you can't use that word like that' arguments. If we're going to be prescriptive about use of 'they' as a definite pronoun we may as well complain about how particular and peculiar swapped meanings in common vernacular.
  - dotancohen 4y ago
    > English is not a prescriptive language Do you mean that there is no single body, like the French have, directing the usage of the language? I would consider "prescriptive / descriptive" to be properties of a dictionary, but not properties of the language itself. I'm not a subject matter expert so I'm not contradicting you, rather I'm asking.
  - TheCoelacanth 4y ago
    If people who are widely considered among the greatest English writers of all time aren't experts in English, then no one is. English is defined by use, and they are the best users of it.
samatman 4y ago
This isn't true though, they has been used for centuries as an indefinite singular pronoun, like "oh someone left their umbrella, they probably want that back let's see if there's a tag". It is the case that using it as a definite singular is new, and we'll see if that lasts.

by usrn 4y ago

tessierashpool 4y ago

this is a common misconception, but it isn't true, and it hasn't been true since the days of Shakespeare, who used they/them as a singular. Jane Austen did the same thing. I don't know who misinformed you on this topic, but I am willing to bet it was not a writer of that caliber. I think we can safely consider Shakespeare and Austen to be experts in the English language.

sitharus 4y ago
I wouldn't consider them experts on the language, since English is not a prescriptive language. However, they do provide good historical references on use of words to avoid the ridiculous 'you can't use that word like that' arguments. If we're going to be prescriptive about use of 'they' as a definite pronoun we may as well complain about how particular and peculiar swapped meanings in common vernacular.
- dotancohen 4y ago
  > English is not a prescriptive language Do you mean that there is no single body, like the French have, directing the usage of the language? I would consider "prescriptive / descriptive" to be properties of a dictionary, but not properties of the language itself. I'm not a subject matter expert so I'm not contradicting you, rather I'm asking.
- TheCoelacanth 4y ago
  If people who are widely considered among the greatest English writers of all time aren't experts in English, then no one is. English is defined by use, and they are the best users of it.

samatman 4y ago

This isn't true though, they has been used for centuries as an indefinite singular pronoun, like "oh someone left their umbrella, they probably want that back let's see if there's a tag". It is the case that using it as a definite singular is new, and we'll see if that lasts.