4 ms·

Atom has been dead for years, this is just the state funeral. The situation now is: * Sublime for the Williamsburg corpo-hipsters * emacs and vim for the wiz

Atom has been dead for years, this is just the state funeral. The situation now is: * Sublime for the Williamsburg corpo-hipsters * emacs and vim for the wizards and furries * VSCode for all the normies who just want to get on with doing their job and don't feel a need to express their identity or politics through choice of editor * WebStorm for the chads with the monster rigs to run it

ThaDood 4y ago
This makes me feel conflicted.
tinco 4y ago
I use VSCode because its Vim plugin is better than that of Sublime. If/when Sublime has caught up, I'd happily go back to it for that sweet performance and uncluttered UI. So am I a normie, a corpo-hipster or a furry wizard?
- throwaway413 4y ago
  Hermione Granger - muggle born with vested corporate interest
- alpaca128 4y ago
  > its Vim plugin is better than that of Sublime I'm pretty sure Sublime has a plugin that uses an actual NeoVim instance to process all inputs with all your configuration. Never tried it, I don't use Sublime. But I can confirm the feature works well in Firefox via FireNvim.
  - tinco 4y ago
    I think this is what vscode does as well. The magic is in how it cooperates with the GUI. All jumps and movements work, as well as search/replace and the hilighting and selections are even the native vscode hilights and selections so it's fluid going from mouse to vim and back. Last time I used Sublime (4+ years ago) there were a bunch of vim commands that didn't work.
- jbiason 4y ago
  The Vim plugin in VSCode is the thing that drives me out of VSCode, to be honest. I have to say that I built so much muscle memory in those years that it is kinda hard to realized I'm not using Vim, and there is always something not-quite-like-vim in VSCode-vim that usually gets in my way. (To be honest, the only editor that I found that is really close to Vim without being a Vim-thing was GNOME Builder.)
fartcannon 4y ago
VSCode is for Xbox gamers.
tristor 4y ago
* Textmate & BBEdit for people who were using Macs for development before they took over the tech industry.
- oblio 4y ago
  All 3 of them?
- MikePlacid 4y ago
  I’ve “just” (as in: a couple of years ago) switched from BBEdit to Atom for my Python development, and now this.
philwelch 4y ago
> emacs and vim for the wizards and furries …respectively? TIL I’m a furry.
- bitwize 4y ago
  Now all you need is a nice comfy pair of programming socks.
  - oblio 4y ago
    And sandals to match :-D
skohan 4y ago
So MS owns the default place where code is hosted, and the default tool people use to edit code. Neat.
- jamil7 4y ago
  Cool and normal.
- oblio 4y ago
  It's kind of bad, but they're probably the least bad behemoth owner. Apple would try to switch everything towards their walked garden, no questions asked. Google would shut stuff down every two years. Oracle... I'm not even going to bother. Amazon and Facebook could be interesting. Facebook is a bit shady, see the Oculus Facebook account debacle, but they're decent as stewards of dev tools. Amazon is also quite reliable for dev tools. Would anyone really big be a better steward? Did I miss someone?
  - skohan 4y ago
    I guess I would vastly prefer an organization which is not one of the tech giants. Facebook/meta seems horrifying. Some of their tools are indeed great, but I can just imagine having to use a facebook login to push code to GitHub or to download VSCode plugins. Amazon is problematic for similar reasons as MS: since they are one of the biggest application hosts out there, bad incentives exist in terms of potentially allowing biases in their tooling to preference their own platform.
- adolfojp 4y ago
  Well, Microsoft has always been about developers, developers, developers...
burlesona 4y ago
"VSCode for all the normies" ... feels weird. Maybe it's true. But I feel like VSCode rose 1:1 with Typescript, and I kind of resent it because I associate it with script kiddies around me cargo-culting React in places it isn't needed and writing thousands of lines of overcomplicated javascript to "manage state" on pages that don't even need to have any. It's also noticeably slower than Sublime, which makes switching hard. But "Williamsburg corpo-hipster" feels off the mark. To me Sublime aligns more around the "JS minimalist" camp, which overlaps a lot with the "bootstrapped and profitable" crowd.
- nemothekid 4y ago
  >JS minimalist I mean, just that phrase sounds very "Williamsburg corpo-hipster" to me. Minimal, artisan javascript.
- wly_cdgr 4y ago
  I am sorry if I hit a nerve, I was just riffing for kicks based on my own limited experience and the fact that I haven't had any coffee yet
omoikane 4y ago
I disagree with these labels, I would say the choice of editor is more religion than politics.
- oldgradstudent 4y ago
  Religion and religious conflict is often an expression of politics. The conflict between Catholics and protestants in northern Ireland is not actually about subtle differences in religious doctrine.
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
derefr 4y ago
Isn’t Sublime also for people whose haven’t bought a new computer in 10 years and so can’t run VSCode? That’s why I started using it, at least. (Now it’s just inertia.)
luoc 4y ago
Only the lack of slurs reminded me I'm not browsing /g/ in the moment
vorpalhex 4y ago
I went back to try Sublime lately and.. it's lost a lot of the minimalism that attracted me to it initially. That was the same reason why I loved Atom during it's golden years before it got too slow. Right now I am using a very stripped down VSCode, which is.. fine. It works. I don't love it but it gets the job done usually. Any other good editors on the minimal side? I need a bit more than vim/emacs, but I don't want or care for autocompletion or anything that alters what I have written. I don't need vcs support. I don't need a built in terminal. Just a good, simple and fast code editing experience with modern ergonomics and syntax highlighting that works across every language.
- MobiusHorizons 4y ago
  Have you tried neovim with any of the lsp integrations? I’m not going to pretend it’s trivial to set up, but the result seems very powerful. If you just want to dip your toes without doing that he setup yourself, I believe there are some prepackaged options eg onivim which you can try out.
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
diarrhea 4y ago
Well put. There's just no reason to move off VSCode so far (for Python and friends). In a couple weeks' time, I'll be working with C# in Visual Studio. It has me excited since I've heard many good things about Microsoft developer tooling, of which VS is a huge tool in the box (C# as a language also seems attractive).
- hansoolo 4y ago
  Can confirm. Also that git integration that everyone talks about in Atom is built right in.
BaseballPhysics 4y ago
> VSCode for all the normies who just want to get on with doing their job and don't feel a need to express their identity or politics through choice of editor Seems like just another kind of identity: The self-titled "normie" who glances over at the "corpo-hipsters" and "wizards and furries" and smugly pats themselves on the back about how they're so much better because, unlike everyone else, they just want to "get on with doing their job"...
- bitwize 4y ago
  The fact is, I can't do my job very effectively with Visual Studio Code. That's why I throw it down in frustration and storm back to Emacs every time I try it. Emacs has features that allow me to pretend to be an organized, functional person on the job -- notably, Magit, org-mode, and always-on Lisp that helps me automate away the tedious unusual bits of our process. If you were to compel me to use Visual Studio Code, much of my effort which is today productive would be lost as waste heat.
- wly_cdgr 4y ago
  Heh, yes, def agree, although I think that a person who is genuinely oblivious or indifferent to all this will also prob end up using VSCode just cos it's free and has the highest brand awareness
racl101 4y ago
TIL I'm a Williamsburg corpo-hipster. This entire time I thought I used Sublime because it was a fast enough, full of features, battle tested editor, that also wasn't a bloated IDE nor an exercise in self flagellation (i.e. choosing to use an command line editor with a high learning curve like Vim or Emacs).
femiagbabiaka 4y ago
No 4Chan tier comments here please.
reactspa 4y ago
Anyone else use Notepad++ ? Why not?
- hansoolo 4y ago
  Occasionally

ThaDood 4y ago

This makes me feel conflicted.

tinco 4y ago

I use VSCode because its Vim plugin is better than that of Sublime. If/when Sublime has caught up, I'd happily go back to it for that sweet performance and uncluttered UI. So am I a normie, a corpo-hipster or a furry wizard?

throwaway413 4y ago
Hermione Granger - muggle born with vested corporate interest
alpaca128 4y ago
> its Vim plugin is better than that of Sublime I'm pretty sure Sublime has a plugin that uses an actual NeoVim instance to process all inputs with all your configuration. Never tried it, I don't use Sublime. But I can confirm the feature works well in Firefox via FireNvim.
- tinco 4y ago
  I think this is what vscode does as well. The magic is in how it cooperates with the GUI. All jumps and movements work, as well as search/replace and the hilighting and selections are even the native vscode hilights and selections so it's fluid going from mouse to vim and back. Last time I used Sublime (4+ years ago) there were a bunch of vim commands that didn't work.
jbiason 4y ago
The Vim plugin in VSCode is the thing that drives me out of VSCode, to be honest. I have to say that I built so much muscle memory in those years that it is kinda hard to realized I'm not using Vim, and there is always something not-quite-like-vim in VSCode-vim that usually gets in my way. (To be honest, the only editor that I found that is really close to Vim without being a Vim-thing was GNOME Builder.)

fartcannon 4y ago

VSCode is for Xbox gamers.

tristor 4y ago

* Textmate & BBEdit for people who were using Macs for development before they took over the tech industry.

oblio 4y ago
All 3 of them?
MikePlacid 4y ago
I’ve “just” (as in: a couple of years ago) switched from BBEdit to Atom for my Python development, and now this.

philwelch 4y ago

> emacs and vim for the wizards and furries …respectively? TIL I’m a furry.

bitwize 4y ago
Now all you need is a nice comfy pair of programming socks.
- oblio 4y ago
  And sandals to match :-D

skohan 4y ago

So MS owns the default place where code is hosted, and the default tool people use to edit code. Neat.

jamil7 4y ago
Cool and normal.
oblio 4y ago
It's kind of bad, but they're probably the least bad behemoth owner. Apple would try to switch everything towards their walked garden, no questions asked. Google would shut stuff down every two years. Oracle... I'm not even going to bother. Amazon and Facebook could be interesting. Facebook is a bit shady, see the Oculus Facebook account debacle, but they're decent as stewards of dev tools. Amazon is also quite reliable for dev tools. Would anyone really big be a better steward? Did I miss someone?
- skohan 4y ago
  I guess I would vastly prefer an organization which is not one of the tech giants. Facebook/meta seems horrifying. Some of their tools are indeed great, but I can just imagine having to use a facebook login to push code to GitHub or to download VSCode plugins. Amazon is problematic for similar reasons as MS: since they are one of the biggest application hosts out there, bad incentives exist in terms of potentially allowing biases in their tooling to preference their own platform.
adolfojp 4y ago
Well, Microsoft has always been about developers, developers, developers...

burlesona 4y ago

"VSCode for all the normies" ... feels weird. Maybe it's true. But I feel like VSCode rose 1:1 with Typescript, and I kind of resent it because I associate it with script kiddies around me cargo-culting React in places it isn't needed and writing thousands of lines of overcomplicated javascript to "manage state" on pages that don't even need to have any. It's also noticeably slower than Sublime, which makes switching hard. But "Williamsburg corpo-hipster" feels off the mark. To me Sublime aligns more around the "JS minimalist" camp, which overlaps a lot with the "bootstrapped and profitable" crowd.

nemothekid 4y ago
>JS minimalist I mean, just that phrase sounds very "Williamsburg corpo-hipster" to me. Minimal, artisan javascript.
wly_cdgr 4y ago
I am sorry if I hit a nerve, I was just riffing for kicks based on my own limited experience and the fact that I haven't had any coffee yet

omoikane 4y ago

I disagree with these labels, I would say the choice of editor is more religion than politics.

oldgradstudent 4y ago
Religion and religious conflict is often an expression of politics. The conflict between Catholics and protestants in northern Ireland is not actually about subtle differences in religious doctrine.

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]

derefr 4y ago

Isn’t Sublime also for people whose haven’t bought a new computer in 10 years and so can’t run VSCode? That’s why I started using it, at least. (Now it’s just inertia.)

luoc 4y ago

Only the lack of slurs reminded me I'm not browsing /g/ in the moment

vorpalhex 4y ago

I went back to try Sublime lately and.. it's lost a lot of the minimalism that attracted me to it initially. That was the same reason why I loved Atom during it's golden years before it got too slow. Right now I am using a very stripped down VSCode, which is.. fine. It works. I don't love it but it gets the job done usually. Any other good editors on the minimal side? I need a bit more than vim/emacs, but I don't want or care for autocompletion or anything that alters what I have written. I don't need vcs support. I don't need a built in terminal. Just a good, simple and fast code editing experience with modern ergonomics and syntax highlighting that works across every language.

MobiusHorizons 4y ago
Have you tried neovim with any of the lsp integrations? I’m not going to pretend it’s trivial to set up, but the result seems very powerful. If you just want to dip your toes without doing that he setup yourself, I believe there are some prepackaged options eg onivim which you can try out.

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]

diarrhea 4y ago

Well put. There's just no reason to move off VSCode so far (for Python and friends). In a couple weeks' time, I'll be working with C# in Visual Studio. It has me excited since I've heard many good things about Microsoft developer tooling, of which VS is a huge tool in the box (C# as a language also seems attractive).

hansoolo 4y ago
Can confirm. Also that git integration that everyone talks about in Atom is built right in.

BaseballPhysics 4y ago

> VSCode for all the normies who just want to get on with doing their job and don't feel a need to express their identity or politics through choice of editor Seems like just another kind of identity: The self-titled "normie" who glances over at the "corpo-hipsters" and "wizards and furries" and smugly pats themselves on the back about how they're so much better because, unlike everyone else, they just want to "get on with doing their job"...

bitwize 4y ago
The fact is, I can't do my job very effectively with Visual Studio Code. That's why I throw it down in frustration and storm back to Emacs every time I try it. Emacs has features that allow me to pretend to be an organized, functional person on the job -- notably, Magit, org-mode, and always-on Lisp that helps me automate away the tedious unusual bits of our process. If you were to compel me to use Visual Studio Code, much of my effort which is today productive would be lost as waste heat.
wly_cdgr 4y ago
Heh, yes, def agree, although I think that a person who is genuinely oblivious or indifferent to all this will also prob end up using VSCode just cos it's free and has the highest brand awareness

racl101 4y ago

TIL I'm a Williamsburg corpo-hipster. This entire time I thought I used Sublime because it was a fast enough, full of features, battle tested editor, that also wasn't a bloated IDE nor an exercise in self flagellation (i.e. choosing to use an command line editor with a high learning curve like Vim or Emacs).

femiagbabiaka 4y ago

No 4Chan tier comments here please.

reactspa 4y ago

Anyone else use Notepad++ ? Why not?

hansoolo 4y ago
Occasionally