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Related: Airbnb and apparently Booking.com are billing Australian customers from overseas, causing customers to incur a bank service charge. This isn't revealed

Related: Airbnb and apparently Booking.com are billing Australian customers from overseas, causing customers to incur a bank service charge. This isn't revealed to the customer in any way. Don't know how this is legal, but the ACCC needs to jump all over it either way. This happened to me a while back and I went ape on Twitter and got the charges refunded by Airbnb. But that's not how it should work.

cottsak 4y ago
link to twitter thread?
- jen729w 4y ago
  I delete my tweets, sorry. It was a few years ago now.
usr1106 4y ago
How does that work? Billing from overseas in AUD or in a foreign currency? Of course if billed in a foreign currency there will be exchange fees. In Europe the exchange fees need to be specified spearately nowdays. For my monthly AWS bill of some 5 USD I get a separate message every time how much the bank or credit card company earned on the fly. Is the currency billed the same as the currency displayed on the site?
- jen729w 4y ago
  All prices were displayed as AUD and there was no indication whatsoever that the billing would occur overseas. But it did, and my bank charged me their fees as one would expect them to do. The Booking.com issue is much more recent. See this letter [0] in the Fairfax 'Traveller letters' column of May 6 2022. "I have been using this booking.com for many years. As a Genius member I received discounts on bookings and more. Last year I booked accommodation and was shocked to see that I had been charged an overseas transaction fee of nearly $50. Enquiries to booking.com were time wasting and fruitless. They blamed the hotel and were of no assistance at all. I eventually found through my bank that the charges were being routed through Amsterdam." — Peter Frederics, Balmain, NSW Similarly my partner ordered flowers last year from a supposedly regional florist and was billed from an overseas system, incurring charges. It happens frequently, and it ought to be illegal in my view. It's cool if you want to offshore your processing to save money: but you have to tell me. [0]: https://www.traveller.com.au/traveller-letters-i-was-charged-overseas-transaction-fees-for-local-hotel-via-booking-website-h23l4w https://www.traveller.com.au/traveller-letters-i-was-charged...
  - usr1106 4y ago
    Still not following what you mean by billing overseas. I would understand what billing in a different currency means and obviously that causes fees. If you are billed in your domestic currency the location should not be relevant to my understanding. But I have little exposure to how things work in Australia. Edit: It has never happened to me that I was billed in a different currency than what was displayed a checkout. However, sometimes there is a little checkbox preselected that they would do the conversion into the currency of my card. I always unselect that. Haven't seen a single case where the rate of my bank would not have been better.
    - jen729w 4y ago
      Airbnb and Booking.com show you a price in AUD. You fully expect to be billed in AUD, from an Australian entity. The company bills you in AUD but from a billing entity overseas. This might be like the situation where you choose in which currency to be billed, I'm not sure on the exact mechanics. But close enough. Crucially, you are not informed that you are being billed from an overseas entity. No indication whatsoever. Your bank, seeing a charge from an overseas entity, applies their surcharges. Whatever they are. And so you pay the amount you expected to pay - totally cool - plus some surprise surcharge - totally uncool.
      - usr1106 4y ago
        If the billing location is relevant for the fees, one would assume that consumer protection legislation requires to display the billing location before the transaction is approved. Whether all foreign businesses will follow the rules is another story. But if no such rule even exists that seems to be a gap in Australian consumer laws. (And as a sibling comment indicates in the US. But the US is generally more business-friendly than consumer-friendly, so I am not surprised.)
    - CaptainZapp 4y ago
      > Haven't seen a single case where the rate of my bank would not have been better. Smart move. You can be sure that when a bank offers you convenience, it's not to your advantage. The absolute worst are ATMs, where a "guaranteed exchange rate" can cost you 50 - 100 Euros, depending on the amount withdrawn.

cottsak 4y ago

link to twitter thread?

jen729w 4y ago
I delete my tweets, sorry. It was a few years ago now.

usr1106 4y ago

How does that work? Billing from overseas in AUD or in a foreign currency? Of course if billed in a foreign currency there will be exchange fees. In Europe the exchange fees need to be specified spearately nowdays. For my monthly AWS bill of some 5 USD I get a separate message every time how much the bank or credit card company earned on the fly. Is the currency billed the same as the currency displayed on the site?

jen729w 4y ago
All prices were displayed as AUD and there was no indication whatsoever that the billing would occur overseas. But it did, and my bank charged me their fees as one would expect them to do. The Booking.com issue is much more recent. See this letter [0] in the Fairfax 'Traveller letters' column of May 6 2022. "I have been using this booking.com for many years. As a Genius member I received discounts on bookings and more. Last year I booked accommodation and was shocked to see that I had been charged an overseas transaction fee of nearly $50. Enquiries to booking.com were time wasting and fruitless. They blamed the hotel and were of no assistance at all. I eventually found through my bank that the charges were being routed through Amsterdam." — Peter Frederics, Balmain, NSW Similarly my partner ordered flowers last year from a supposedly regional florist and was billed from an overseas system, incurring charges. It happens frequently, and it ought to be illegal in my view. It's cool if you want to offshore your processing to save money: but you have to tell me. [0]: https://www.traveller.com.au/traveller-letters-i-was-charged-overseas-transaction-fees-for-local-hotel-via-booking-website-h23l4w https://www.traveller.com.au/traveller-letters-i-was-charged...
- usr1106 4y ago
  Still not following what you mean by billing overseas. I would understand what billing in a different currency means and obviously that causes fees. If you are billed in your domestic currency the location should not be relevant to my understanding. But I have little exposure to how things work in Australia. Edit: It has never happened to me that I was billed in a different currency than what was displayed a checkout. However, sometimes there is a little checkbox preselected that they would do the conversion into the currency of my card. I always unselect that. Haven't seen a single case where the rate of my bank would not have been better.
  - jen729w 4y ago
    Airbnb and Booking.com show you a price in AUD. You fully expect to be billed in AUD, from an Australian entity. The company bills you in AUD but from a billing entity overseas. This might be like the situation where you choose in which currency to be billed, I'm not sure on the exact mechanics. But close enough. Crucially, you are not informed that you are being billed from an overseas entity. No indication whatsoever. Your bank, seeing a charge from an overseas entity, applies their surcharges. Whatever they are. And so you pay the amount you expected to pay - totally cool - plus some surprise surcharge - totally uncool.
    - usr1106 4y ago
      If the billing location is relevant for the fees, one would assume that consumer protection legislation requires to display the billing location before the transaction is approved. Whether all foreign businesses will follow the rules is another story. But if no such rule even exists that seems to be a gap in Australian consumer laws. (And as a sibling comment indicates in the US. But the US is generally more business-friendly than consumer-friendly, so I am not surprised.)
  - CaptainZapp 4y ago
    > Haven't seen a single case where the rate of my bank would not have been better. Smart move. You can be sure that when a bank offers you convenience, it's not to your advantage. The absolute worst are ATMs, where a "guaranteed exchange rate" can cost you 50 - 100 Euros, depending on the amount withdrawn.