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I think it’s less impressive than you think. Most of the ocean is incredibly deep and the bottom isn’t that interesting. You really need to be (relatively) clos

I think it’s less impressive than you think. Most of the ocean is incredibly deep and the bottom isn’t that interesting. You really need to be (relatively) close-ish to shore and (relatively) shallow to see what most people think of as interesting. In Florida, where I grew up, the state would sink old barges, tires, cement tubes left over from construction projects, etc. to make artificial reefs. Those were pretty cool because they were near shore and attracted the whole food chain from algae and coral all the way up to sharks and other apex predators. Do that in the middle of the ocean and you just add a new pile of junk that maybe a couple tiny shrimp and sightless fish call home.

analog31 4y ago
That would be a good use for all of the oligarch super-yachts they're seizing. For one thing, they can't be sold. The market is going to be flooded with super-yachts. For another, nobody who wants to buy a super-yacht will want to disclose where their money is coming from, or who the actual owner is going to be.
- paulcole 4y ago
  In The Ministry For the Future (World War Z style novel about what the near future might look like as climate change really takes hold) there’s a group that torpedos ships with shipping containers and uses drones to take down private jets and cargo planes. The idea being that if they do it enough, demand will dry up. It’s a very interesting book.
  - thrwy_meta 4y ago
    I like to brainstorm "engineering black swan events", and thought it would be interesting to use torpedoes/unmanned submersible IEDs/fertilizer-filled bulk freighters to attack major container ports, while simultaneously shorting the stocks of the publicly-traded companies that own/operate them. They seem like a very vulnerable part of the world's economy/supply chain.
- s1artibartfast 4y ago
  Most ships aren't worth the cost to decontaminate and sink due to various environmental regulations. Some are reasonable and some are not. I assume most of the superyacht will eventually go back to their owners where in relations with Russia are normalized if they have not deteriorated into worthlessness
  - trasz 4y ago
    That's probably the worst possible scenario. Even a series of accidental fires would be a better outcome.
    - s1artibartfast 4y ago
      Why is that? Giving them back wouldn't particularly bother me. I think worst case is paying Russia cash value for the stolen yachts
      - trasz 4y ago
        Giving them back would reinforce Russia's belief that it can commit any kind of crime with impunity, which would then result in it becoming even more aggressive.
- trasz 4y ago
  Why not just sell them cheaper?
mrow84 4y ago
I think you’re probably broadly right, because containers won’t be very useful, but in different circumstances things can be more complex than “a couple tiny shrimp and sightless fish”: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whale_fall https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whale_fall
duskwuff 4y ago
> In Florida, where I grew up, the state would sink old barges, tires, cement tubes left over from construction projects, etc. to make artificial reefs. On the other hand, some of those projects were a net negative for the environment, e.g. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Osborne_Reef https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Osborne_Reef

analog31 4y ago

That would be a good use for all of the oligarch super-yachts they're seizing. For one thing, they can't be sold. The market is going to be flooded with super-yachts. For another, nobody who wants to buy a super-yacht will want to disclose where their money is coming from, or who the actual owner is going to be.

paulcole 4y ago
In The Ministry For the Future (World War Z style novel about what the near future might look like as climate change really takes hold) there’s a group that torpedos ships with shipping containers and uses drones to take down private jets and cargo planes. The idea being that if they do it enough, demand will dry up. It’s a very interesting book.
- thrwy_meta 4y ago
  I like to brainstorm "engineering black swan events", and thought it would be interesting to use torpedoes/unmanned submersible IEDs/fertilizer-filled bulk freighters to attack major container ports, while simultaneously shorting the stocks of the publicly-traded companies that own/operate them. They seem like a very vulnerable part of the world's economy/supply chain.
s1artibartfast 4y ago
Most ships aren't worth the cost to decontaminate and sink due to various environmental regulations. Some are reasonable and some are not. I assume most of the superyacht will eventually go back to their owners where in relations with Russia are normalized if they have not deteriorated into worthlessness
- trasz 4y ago
  That's probably the worst possible scenario. Even a series of accidental fires would be a better outcome.
  - s1artibartfast 4y ago
    Why is that? Giving them back wouldn't particularly bother me. I think worst case is paying Russia cash value for the stolen yachts
    - trasz 4y ago
      Giving them back would reinforce Russia's belief that it can commit any kind of crime with impunity, which would then result in it becoming even more aggressive.
trasz 4y ago
Why not just sell them cheaper?

mrow84 4y ago

I think you’re probably broadly right, because containers won’t be very useful, but in different circumstances things can be more complex than “a couple tiny shrimp and sightless fish”: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whale_fall https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whale_fall

duskwuff 4y ago

> In Florida, where I grew up, the state would sink old barges, tires, cement tubes left over from construction projects, etc. to make artificial reefs. On the other hand, some of those projects were a net negative for the environment, e.g. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Osborne_Reef https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Osborne_Reef